1 00:00:02,270 --> 00:00:32,549 [Music] 2 00:00:37,510 --> 00:00:34,709 hey guys how's it going welcome back to 3 00:00:39,590 --> 00:00:37,520 the disclosure team youtube channel 4 00:00:41,670 --> 00:00:39,600 um this is going to be a really good 5 00:00:44,150 --> 00:00:41,680 conversation i'm really excited for this 6 00:00:45,190 --> 00:00:44,160 one two of my colleagues from uap media 7 00:00:48,869 --> 00:00:45,200 uk 8 00:00:50,310 --> 00:00:48,879 let's bring them straight in mr graham 9 00:00:51,590 --> 00:00:50,320 randall 10 00:00:53,670 --> 00:00:51,600 and 11 00:00:58,229 --> 00:00:53,680 mr tanzer strum thank you both for 12 00:00:59,910 --> 00:00:58,239 joining me um yeah how are ya 13 00:01:04,789 --> 00:00:59,920 oh great thank you yeah how are you both 14 00:01:10,550 --> 00:01:07,590 a british reserve they there we go man 15 00:01:11,670 --> 00:01:10,560 but yeah i'm glad you're both okay um 16 00:01:13,750 --> 00:01:11,680 yeah this is going to be a really good 17 00:01:15,830 --> 00:01:13,760 conversation obviously i'm just so 18 00:01:17,429 --> 00:01:15,840 excited now that the book's been out for 19 00:01:20,070 --> 00:01:17,439 a little while graham 20 00:01:22,950 --> 00:01:20,080 um we'll go into all of how it's been 21 00:01:24,789 --> 00:01:22,960 received and maybe even dive into a few 22 00:01:27,510 --> 00:01:24,799 of the stories i know you've covered a 23 00:01:29,190 --> 00:01:27,520 little bit already on like um ucr and 24 00:01:31,910 --> 00:01:29,200 stuff but i'll cover some different 25 00:01:34,149 --> 00:01:31,920 stuff how about that for you that sounds 26 00:01:36,310 --> 00:01:34,159 amazing thank you so much and i have got 27 00:01:38,230 --> 00:01:36,320 it as my background behind us but i i 28 00:01:40,069 --> 00:01:38,240 guess we can't see that much 29 00:01:41,910 --> 00:01:40,079 but i've also will will show it to 30 00:01:44,069 --> 00:01:41,920 everyone because i've got it and i'll 31 00:01:46,630 --> 00:01:44,079 share my screen dan sent me a really 32 00:01:48,710 --> 00:01:46,640 nice version of it 33 00:01:49,749 --> 00:01:48,720 yeah of course is that because the 34 00:01:51,429 --> 00:01:49,759 images 35 00:01:53,109 --> 00:01:51,439 oh no i see it sorry it's behind our 36 00:01:54,870 --> 00:01:53,119 windows it's behind sorry i was looking 37 00:01:56,550 --> 00:01:54,880 behind you 38 00:01:57,990 --> 00:01:56,560 you know what i spent a bit of time 39 00:01:59,830 --> 00:01:58,000 playing around with it i was going to 40 00:02:02,230 --> 00:01:59,840 have it behind me and i thought we'll 41 00:02:03,590 --> 00:02:02,240 just have it behind us all yeah yeah 42 00:02:08,710 --> 00:02:03,600 it's cool it kind of looks like i'm 43 00:02:12,150 --> 00:02:10,790 i'd rather be you than somebody else 44 00:02:13,830 --> 00:02:12,160 i'm a terrible child you're going to be 45 00:02:15,270 --> 00:02:13,840 fine 46 00:02:16,869 --> 00:02:15,280 so yeah like i said we'll get into the 47 00:02:18,470 --> 00:02:16,879 book we'll talk about it and maybe just 48 00:02:20,470 --> 00:02:18,480 go off on a tangent on a few other 49 00:02:21,589 --> 00:02:20,480 subjects you know 50 00:02:23,030 --> 00:02:21,599 if you're happy with that we've been 51 00:02:25,110 --> 00:02:23,040 having some weird and wonderful 52 00:02:27,910 --> 00:02:25,120 conversations behind the scenes through 53 00:02:30,150 --> 00:02:27,920 our uap media uk chat 54 00:02:32,070 --> 00:02:30,160 which it just makes me think a few weeks 55 00:02:34,070 --> 00:02:32,080 ago when i joined and you guys told me 56 00:02:35,589 --> 00:02:34,080 that what to expect 57 00:02:38,150 --> 00:02:35,599 and i think we'll touch upon that 58 00:02:39,750 --> 00:02:38,160 because the conversations just do go off 59 00:02:42,150 --> 00:02:39,760 in so many different areas and i 60 00:02:45,430 --> 00:02:42,160 absolutely love it even if i don't 61 00:02:47,750 --> 00:02:45,440 contribute sometimes re i read them all 62 00:02:49,670 --> 00:02:47,760 and it's absolutely amazing so i'm just 63 00:02:51,190 --> 00:02:49,680 gonna address 64 00:02:52,470 --> 00:02:51,200 everyone in the chat we've got a few 65 00:02:54,390 --> 00:02:52,480 people in here 66 00:02:56,390 --> 00:02:54,400 thank you for being here guys um if 67 00:02:58,070 --> 00:02:56,400 you've got any questions fire away we're 68 00:02:59,670 --> 00:02:58,080 not you don't have to super chat or 69 00:03:02,149 --> 00:02:59,680 anything like that i'm not i'm not big 70 00:03:04,869 --> 00:03:02,159 on that um so just just you know 71 00:03:07,589 --> 00:03:04,879 ask questions and we'll get there uh one 72 00:03:10,070 --> 00:03:07,599 thing i will say as well i 73 00:03:12,149 --> 00:03:10,080 i was gonna wear the t-shirt but it it 74 00:03:14,309 --> 00:03:12,159 was blurring my green screen and stuff 75 00:03:16,390 --> 00:03:14,319 but i've got the t-shirt graham i've 76 00:03:19,110 --> 00:03:16,400 been reading the kindle 77 00:03:20,070 --> 00:03:19,120 and i ordered the paperback last night 78 00:03:22,390 --> 00:03:20,080 as well 79 00:03:25,830 --> 00:03:22,400 oh wow thank you above and beyond the 80 00:03:27,750 --> 00:03:25,840 call of duty well you know i everyone 81 00:03:29,750 --> 00:03:27,760 has been showing this paperback and how 82 00:03:32,309 --> 00:03:29,760 it feels in their hands 83 00:03:34,309 --> 00:03:32,319 um and i did a little bit of a a book 84 00:03:36,949 --> 00:03:34,319 blitz and ordered like seven books on 85 00:03:39,190 --> 00:03:36,959 amazon just to start building up a ufo 86 00:03:42,229 --> 00:03:39,200 collection and yours had to be in there 87 00:03:45,270 --> 00:03:42,239 so thank you no hey it's my pleasure man 88 00:03:47,990 --> 00:03:45,280 so great graham is just uh today he he 89 00:03:49,830 --> 00:03:48,000 messaged me saying he'd uh he'd put my 90 00:03:51,670 --> 00:03:49,840 complimentary copy in the post that's 91 00:03:53,509 --> 00:03:51,680 signed by him and i'm very excited to to 92 00:03:54,949 --> 00:03:53,519 pop her on my shelf 93 00:03:56,470 --> 00:03:54,959 yeah that's the thing the only thing 94 00:03:58,309 --> 00:03:56,480 with me is i really would love to have 95 00:03:59,589 --> 00:03:58,319 this book displayed behind me but i just 96 00:04:02,470 --> 00:03:59,599 green screen it because you don't want 97 00:04:06,949 --> 00:04:05,030 i'll have to build a giant bookshelf and 98 00:04:10,789 --> 00:04:06,959 make it look like i've got lots of 99 00:04:12,789 --> 00:04:10,799 interesting books when i really haven't 100 00:04:14,789 --> 00:04:12,799 oh look ryan sprague in the chat hello 101 00:04:16,469 --> 00:04:14,799 ryan how's it going good to see you in 102 00:04:18,229 --> 00:04:16,479 here good to see everyone jumping in 103 00:04:21,670 --> 00:04:18,239 here um 104 00:04:23,350 --> 00:04:21,680 you are sorry dan i just seen hello ryan 105 00:04:26,070 --> 00:04:23,360 it's it's whenever i see ryan it's a 106 00:04:27,830 --> 00:04:26,080 pinch me moment just because 107 00:04:29,990 --> 00:04:27,840 you know he was one of the people that i 108 00:04:31,909 --> 00:04:30,000 watched before i kind of you know waded 109 00:04:33,110 --> 00:04:31,919 into the deep end and yeah he's here 110 00:04:35,030 --> 00:04:33,120 watching us 111 00:04:37,350 --> 00:04:35,040 i'm exactly the same man it's very 112 00:04:38,950 --> 00:04:37,360 strange vinnie when these people who you 113 00:04:40,469 --> 00:04:38,960 know i just used to listen to podcasts 114 00:04:41,590 --> 00:04:40,479 there was somebody behind a microphone 115 00:04:43,909 --> 00:04:41,600 sometimes i didn't even know what they 116 00:04:45,590 --> 00:04:43,919 looked like in real life and now i'm 117 00:04:48,070 --> 00:04:45,600 speaking to them you know they they're 118 00:04:49,590 --> 00:04:48,080 messaging me speaking to me and it's i 119 00:04:51,350 --> 00:04:49,600 do i have to pinch myself i said that 120 00:04:53,189 --> 00:04:51,360 this way the other day i really have to 121 00:04:55,670 --> 00:04:53,199 wake up in sometimes and just go is this 122 00:04:58,070 --> 00:04:55,680 really happening so yeah it's wonderful 123 00:05:00,629 --> 00:04:58,080 it's all about completely i feel exactly 124 00:05:01,749 --> 00:05:00,639 the same like literally the same feeling 125 00:05:04,790 --> 00:05:01,759 and it doesn't 126 00:05:06,390 --> 00:05:04,800 you don't get used to it it's bizarre 127 00:05:10,070 --> 00:05:06,400 it's bizarre 128 00:05:12,230 --> 00:05:10,080 um oh look we've got mr ryan has asked 129 00:05:15,189 --> 00:05:12,240 who watches the watchmen and i just want 130 00:05:19,189 --> 00:05:15,199 to say it's um the dod ig that that's 131 00:05:24,550 --> 00:05:21,430 great answer yeah 132 00:05:26,710 --> 00:05:24,560 love it love it um luis jimenez i assume 133 00:05:28,629 --> 00:05:26,720 behind the unidentified celebrity review 134 00:05:31,189 --> 00:05:28,639 good to see you here we will be talking 135 00:05:32,710 --> 00:05:31,199 about the big phone home i did watch all 136 00:05:33,830 --> 00:05:32,720 three days 137 00:05:35,029 --> 00:05:33,840 all of it 138 00:05:37,270 --> 00:05:35,039 that's probably why i look a little bit 139 00:05:39,749 --> 00:05:37,280 more tired today it's been a few late 140 00:05:41,749 --> 00:05:39,759 nights well it kind of started late for 141 00:05:44,469 --> 00:05:41,759 us over here right you know 142 00:05:46,390 --> 00:05:44,479 five i think it was 5 p.m um and then it 143 00:05:47,749 --> 00:05:46,400 went into the kind of wee hours and yeah 144 00:05:49,590 --> 00:05:47,759 same as you i found myself kind of 145 00:05:52,710 --> 00:05:49,600 staying up because some of those panels 146 00:05:54,310 --> 00:05:52,720 were great i couldn't stop in fact all 147 00:05:56,870 --> 00:05:54,320 of them were 148 00:05:58,390 --> 00:05:56,880 it was good that we got to do our day 149 00:06:00,469 --> 00:05:58,400 and do the family thing and then in the 150 00:06:03,029 --> 00:06:00,479 evening got to start it there was 151 00:06:04,629 --> 00:06:03,039 benefits to that but then i guess not so 152 00:06:06,390 --> 00:06:04,639 beneficial when you're going into the 153 00:06:09,510 --> 00:06:06,400 wee hours and you're like 154 00:06:11,189 --> 00:06:09,520 ah this is so amazing but i'm tired 155 00:06:12,790 --> 00:06:11,199 you two you 156 00:06:14,150 --> 00:06:12,800 me i had to sort of quit about ten 157 00:06:15,830 --> 00:06:14,160 o'clock each night and then i'll just 158 00:06:17,270 --> 00:06:15,840 watch the rest you know six o'clock next 159 00:06:19,749 --> 00:06:17,280 morning i would just watch the rest in 160 00:06:21,430 --> 00:06:19,759 one big swoop sort of thing so yeah i 161 00:06:23,430 --> 00:06:21,440 envy you guys setting up doing small 162 00:06:25,670 --> 00:06:23,440 hours don't don't envy 163 00:06:29,510 --> 00:06:25,680 we've got these clockwork oranges 164 00:06:32,309 --> 00:06:29,520 contraptions that keep us awake 165 00:06:34,870 --> 00:06:32,319 oh indeed indeed oh 166 00:06:36,469 --> 00:06:34,880 so let's let's jump into to the main 167 00:06:38,870 --> 00:06:36,479 reason why we're here and that is the 168 00:06:40,309 --> 00:06:38,880 book graham um like i said i know you've 169 00:06:42,070 --> 00:06:40,319 spoken about it a couple of times since 170 00:06:43,029 --> 00:06:42,080 it's been released but yeah let's start 171 00:06:44,469 --> 00:06:43,039 with 172 00:06:46,390 --> 00:06:44,479 how long has been out now a week 173 00:06:48,150 --> 00:06:46,400 something like that it's been about uh 174 00:06:49,830 --> 00:06:48,160 maybe just under two weeks now just 175 00:06:52,870 --> 00:06:49,840 under two weeks that seems to have flown 176 00:06:54,629 --> 00:06:52,880 by but um it does how has it been and 177 00:06:56,950 --> 00:06:54,639 has it um 178 00:06:58,710 --> 00:06:56,960 gone above and beyond expectations or 179 00:07:00,070 --> 00:06:58,720 like just just give us your general 180 00:07:01,510 --> 00:07:00,080 feeling 181 00:07:03,430 --> 00:07:01,520 really when you're i mean i'm not a 182 00:07:05,670 --> 00:07:03,440 first time author but i have i've only 183 00:07:08,150 --> 00:07:05,680 released three books um the the two on 184 00:07:09,830 --> 00:07:08,160 on on ufos and the thing is you never 185 00:07:12,150 --> 00:07:09,840 know how they're going to be received 186 00:07:13,510 --> 00:07:12,160 you know you have an idea based on like 187 00:07:15,430 --> 00:07:13,520 what people were saying on twitter when 188 00:07:16,870 --> 00:07:15,440 i said i was writing it and i got some 189 00:07:18,469 --> 00:07:16,880 really nice comments and people were 190 00:07:19,430 --> 00:07:18,479 saying oh yeah i look forward to it but 191 00:07:21,270 --> 00:07:19,440 at the end of the day you'd actually 192 00:07:22,950 --> 00:07:21,280 never know you know whether you are 193 00:07:25,270 --> 00:07:22,960 going to sell copies whether it's going 194 00:07:26,550 --> 00:07:25,280 to sort of be you know appreciated 195 00:07:27,670 --> 00:07:26,560 whether when people read it whether 196 00:07:28,710 --> 00:07:27,680 they're going to enjoy it or whether 197 00:07:29,990 --> 00:07:28,720 they're going to take it seriously or 198 00:07:31,110 --> 00:07:30,000 not and then of course you don't know 199 00:07:33,430 --> 00:07:31,120 what the comments are going to be like 200 00:07:35,110 --> 00:07:33,440 afterwards as well so at the moment i'm 201 00:07:37,029 --> 00:07:35,120 in this kind of like hiatus this kind of 202 00:07:39,270 --> 00:07:37,039 limbo waiting for people to finish the 203 00:07:40,710 --> 00:07:39,280 book and then let me know how they feel 204 00:07:42,150 --> 00:07:40,720 and i'm always conscious of the fact 205 00:07:45,029 --> 00:07:42,160 that somebody might just turn around go 206 00:07:46,790 --> 00:07:45,039 it's crap so 207 00:07:48,230 --> 00:07:46,800 i'm hoping not but you know you have 208 00:07:50,790 --> 00:07:48,240 that kind of sinking feeling that you 209 00:07:52,869 --> 00:07:50,800 think oh god what about unleashed here 210 00:07:54,869 --> 00:07:52,879 um so i'm hoping it's going to be well 211 00:07:56,869 --> 00:07:54,879 received and i'm desperate for people to 212 00:07:58,869 --> 00:07:56,879 actually let me know you know how they 213 00:07:59,990 --> 00:07:58,879 found it and what they've got out of it 214 00:08:01,350 --> 00:08:00,000 and whether there's anything i could 215 00:08:04,070 --> 00:08:01,360 have put in or how it could have said 216 00:08:05,430 --> 00:08:04,080 differently or or how just you know just 217 00:08:07,189 --> 00:08:05,440 their their feelings about the book 218 00:08:09,029 --> 00:08:07,199 basically i'm also desperate for some 219 00:08:10,790 --> 00:08:09,039 amazon reviews i've got a couple already 220 00:08:12,710 --> 00:08:10,800 but i'd love to have some people who i 221 00:08:14,150 --> 00:08:12,720 don't know coming forward to say you 222 00:08:15,670 --> 00:08:14,160 know this is this is what i felt about 223 00:08:17,029 --> 00:08:15,680 the book good bad or indifferent you 224 00:08:19,830 --> 00:08:17,039 know it all helps 225 00:08:20,710 --> 00:08:19,840 yeah no absolutely i mean i'm a i'm 226 00:08:22,309 --> 00:08:20,720 probably 227 00:08:23,670 --> 00:08:22,319 getting towards halfway point now and it 228 00:08:25,589 --> 00:08:23,680 is it's 229 00:08:29,110 --> 00:08:25,599 it's still as good as it was from the 230 00:08:31,990 --> 00:08:29,120 start is the depth and detail is an 231 00:08:33,909 --> 00:08:32,000 incredible and it's inspired me to to 232 00:08:36,149 --> 00:08:33,919 show where you should go with your level 233 00:08:38,310 --> 00:08:36,159 of research and how deep you really 234 00:08:40,389 --> 00:08:38,320 should go and so it's it's it's an 235 00:08:41,350 --> 00:08:40,399 incredible tool as well as an incredible 236 00:08:44,070 --> 00:08:41,360 book 237 00:08:45,670 --> 00:08:44,080 so yeah thank you for that personally 238 00:08:46,470 --> 00:08:45,680 you know 239 00:08:47,509 --> 00:08:46,480 so 240 00:08:49,269 --> 00:08:47,519 um 241 00:08:51,190 --> 00:08:49,279 and also what i will say with regards to 242 00:08:52,710 --> 00:08:51,200 the amazon things if i see it anywhere 243 00:08:54,550 --> 00:08:52,720 or anyone saying i'm going to read this 244 00:08:57,910 --> 00:08:54,560 and that i will always comment make sure 245 00:08:59,590 --> 00:08:57,920 you give it an amazon review um yeah 246 00:09:01,829 --> 00:08:59,600 joss and you're just in your comments i 247 00:09:03,670 --> 00:09:01,839 believe he's from holland um i think he 248 00:09:06,070 --> 00:09:03,680 said you know where can you get it from 249 00:09:07,910 --> 00:09:06,080 um amazon holland um that you know dot n 250 00:09:09,190 --> 00:09:07,920 l site up you can probably find it 251 00:09:10,470 --> 00:09:09,200 through there so 252 00:09:12,389 --> 00:09:10,480 you can get on pretty much all the 253 00:09:14,150 --> 00:09:12,399 different amazon portals it's certainly 254 00:09:15,990 --> 00:09:14,160 available right across the world i made 255 00:09:17,910 --> 00:09:16,000 sure that it was 256 00:09:20,389 --> 00:09:17,920 and one good thing we've noticed as well 257 00:09:23,190 --> 00:09:20,399 is the speed with its is what it gets 258 00:09:25,110 --> 00:09:23,200 posted out and and received by people is 259 00:09:27,910 --> 00:09:25,120 it's literally a few days you know to 260 00:09:29,430 --> 00:09:27,920 from i think it's buy to print to buy or 261 00:09:30,790 --> 00:09:29,440 buy to print i forget the the 262 00:09:32,230 --> 00:09:30,800 terminology yeah it's print print on 263 00:09:34,790 --> 00:09:32,240 demand and i think 264 00:09:36,949 --> 00:09:34,800 when when lewis when he actually ordered 265 00:09:39,590 --> 00:09:36,959 a copy i believe on sunday and he said 266 00:09:41,750 --> 00:09:39,600 he got it on tuesday so that's crackers 267 00:09:43,030 --> 00:09:41,760 two days turn around um the author 268 00:09:44,790 --> 00:09:43,040 copies because i'm obviously getting 269 00:09:47,030 --> 00:09:44,800 copies to send out to people like like 270 00:09:49,110 --> 00:09:47,040 dan and olaf as well bossy you know as a 271 00:09:50,550 --> 00:09:49,120 thank you for for doing the cover um 272 00:09:53,829 --> 00:09:50,560 they take considerably longer because i 273 00:09:55,509 --> 00:09:53,839 get the multi at cost price um so yeah 274 00:09:57,590 --> 00:09:55,519 you know that takes like a week or 275 00:09:59,190 --> 00:09:57,600 something or maybe even 10 days for the 276 00:10:00,470 --> 00:09:59,200 for those books to get to me so that's 277 00:10:01,829 --> 00:10:00,480 why there's been a delay in sending 278 00:10:04,949 --> 00:10:01,839 danny spooky it's not like i've just 279 00:10:07,509 --> 00:10:04,959 been dragging my feet 280 00:10:09,269 --> 00:10:07,519 making me sweat yeah yeah 281 00:10:10,630 --> 00:10:09,279 i'll have to i'll have to post my copy 282 00:10:12,310 --> 00:10:10,640 off to you graeme get it get it 283 00:10:14,069 --> 00:10:12,320 personally signed and stuff like that 284 00:10:15,350 --> 00:10:14,079 and i'll just do it when i see you next 285 00:10:17,990 --> 00:10:15,360 vinnie 286 00:10:19,190 --> 00:10:18,000 that way late even better even better 287 00:10:20,710 --> 00:10:19,200 i'll come down and see in sheffield or 288 00:10:22,470 --> 00:10:20,720 something like that how about that 289 00:10:24,069 --> 00:10:22,480 any time mate i've got a spare room we 290 00:10:25,829 --> 00:10:24,079 can stay i'll 291 00:10:28,430 --> 00:10:25,839 we'll go out have a couple of glasses of 292 00:10:31,750 --> 00:10:28,440 red wine and so it's good that'll be 293 00:10:33,850 --> 00:10:31,760 fantastic and that's open to to everyone 294 00:10:38,870 --> 00:10:33,860 in uap media uk sorry chat 295 00:10:42,230 --> 00:10:38,880 [Laughter] 296 00:10:43,590 --> 00:10:42,240 he's got an airbnb sideline 297 00:10:45,430 --> 00:10:43,600 it's not a bad shot you know i've got 298 00:10:47,430 --> 00:10:45,440 this i'm literally in my attic room now 299 00:10:48,550 --> 00:10:47,440 it is huge and i've got this 300 00:10:51,590 --> 00:10:48,560 glorious 301 00:10:53,350 --> 00:10:51,600 vintage french antique double bed that 302 00:10:54,790 --> 00:10:53,360 doesn't get used so 303 00:10:57,990 --> 00:10:54,800 it's the kind of the guest room as well 304 00:11:00,389 --> 00:10:58,000 as my office and studio so yeah it's 305 00:11:02,389 --> 00:11:00,399 where people crash when they come that's 306 00:11:03,509 --> 00:11:02,399 cool i'll come down and just the whole 307 00:11:05,509 --> 00:11:03,519 time i'm there i'll leave a stream 308 00:11:06,570 --> 00:11:05,519 running the whole time we'll just talk 309 00:11:08,230 --> 00:11:06,580 to everyone 310 00:11:10,470 --> 00:11:08,240 [Laughter] 311 00:11:11,829 --> 00:11:10,480 yeah just just be aware the camera is 312 00:11:13,350 --> 00:11:11,839 going to be on all the time if you do 313 00:11:14,949 --> 00:11:13,360 that 314 00:11:17,910 --> 00:11:14,959 people know what real life looks like 315 00:11:17,920 --> 00:11:21,670 hey man you said it not me 316 00:11:25,829 --> 00:11:23,190 oh no 317 00:11:29,509 --> 00:11:25,839 i like how i like how um dutch uap 318 00:11:32,150 --> 00:11:29,519 wilfred says oh copy is delivered by uap 319 00:11:33,590 --> 00:11:32,160 hey it must be if it's that quick 320 00:11:35,590 --> 00:11:33,600 blimey 321 00:11:37,350 --> 00:11:35,600 definitely man this is what these um 322 00:11:39,190 --> 00:11:37,360 unknown drones are that are flying 323 00:11:40,550 --> 00:11:39,200 around tucson and stuff they're just 324 00:11:45,350 --> 00:11:40,560 it's amazing 325 00:11:50,629 --> 00:11:47,910 is clearly better um printing books on 326 00:11:55,190 --> 00:11:50,639 demand than he is a space travel yeah 327 00:12:00,710 --> 00:11:57,829 so graham did here's a question i don't 328 00:12:02,710 --> 00:12:00,720 know if it's been asked or not did you 329 00:12:04,470 --> 00:12:02,720 did you stumble across any difficulties 330 00:12:06,870 --> 00:12:04,480 when writing the book something that you 331 00:12:09,190 --> 00:12:06,880 really wanted to do or write whether it 332 00:12:11,910 --> 00:12:09,200 be a story or something that you just 333 00:12:14,710 --> 00:12:11,920 kept hitting roadblocks or struggling to 334 00:12:16,470 --> 00:12:14,720 find conclusions or data or information 335 00:12:17,829 --> 00:12:16,480 but you asw 336 00:12:19,829 --> 00:12:17,839 persistent 337 00:12:21,350 --> 00:12:19,839 yep definitely so 338 00:12:22,790 --> 00:12:21,360 everybody comes up to you and say when 339 00:12:24,389 --> 00:12:22,800 you're looking at foo fighters and when 340 00:12:25,829 --> 00:12:24,399 you're reading source material or you're 341 00:12:27,269 --> 00:12:25,839 reading stuff on the internet just to 342 00:12:28,710 --> 00:12:27,279 try and get some background and you 343 00:12:30,389 --> 00:12:28,720 always get the story well the germans 344 00:12:32,790 --> 00:12:30,399 saw them too and it's something that you 345 00:12:34,629 --> 00:12:32,800 see everywhere and it's a lovely it's a 346 00:12:36,150 --> 00:12:34,639 lovely anecdote but i wish i had a quid 347 00:12:38,069 --> 00:12:36,160 for every time i've heard i've either 348 00:12:39,750 --> 00:12:38,079 read it or heard it from somebody 349 00:12:42,150 --> 00:12:39,760 because actually trying to track down 350 00:12:43,750 --> 00:12:42,160 the stories of the luftwaffe 351 00:12:46,389 --> 00:12:43,760 you know seeing these kind of things for 352 00:12:48,710 --> 00:12:46,399 themselves is incredibly difficult 353 00:12:50,470 --> 00:12:48,720 if it's in the records then they must be 354 00:12:52,710 --> 00:12:50,480 buried away somewhere because i've never 355 00:12:55,110 --> 00:12:52,720 ever seen reference to actual particular 356 00:12:56,389 --> 00:12:55,120 documents from the luftwaffe archives 357 00:12:57,910 --> 00:12:56,399 now actually in america because they 358 00:12:59,670 --> 00:12:57,920 were taken there after the wall but 359 00:13:01,030 --> 00:12:59,680 nobody's ever come across them i'm not 360 00:13:02,150 --> 00:13:01,040 entirely sure anybody's really looked 361 00:13:03,910 --> 00:13:02,160 through them but you'd have to have a 362 00:13:05,829 --> 00:13:03,920 you know be fairly fluent in german to 363 00:13:07,750 --> 00:13:05,839 understand them and you also have to be 364 00:13:10,069 --> 00:13:07,760 fairly fluent in german sort of you know 365 00:13:12,230 --> 00:13:10,079 military um kind of you know the lingo 366 00:13:13,509 --> 00:13:12,240 to be able to understand as well so 367 00:13:15,430 --> 00:13:13,519 there's a couple of handicaps there for 368 00:13:16,870 --> 00:13:15,440 somebody like me um i mean i do know a 369 00:13:19,990 --> 00:13:16,880 little bit of german but i'm not by 370 00:13:22,389 --> 00:13:20,000 means fluent in it at all um so that's 371 00:13:25,430 --> 00:13:22,399 one obstacle but also it's just the case 372 00:13:26,790 --> 00:13:25,440 of the stories that are 373 00:13:27,990 --> 00:13:26,800 but that they're i mean i don't know if 374 00:13:29,590 --> 00:13:28,000 you've got to that part of the book yet 375 00:13:31,350 --> 00:13:29,600 but i have a chapter with the stories 376 00:13:33,670 --> 00:13:31,360 i've been able to find or that being 377 00:13:35,910 --> 00:13:33,680 able to dug up um 378 00:13:37,910 --> 00:13:35,920 from some really obscure locations and 379 00:13:40,069 --> 00:13:37,920 actually i don't put much stock between 380 00:13:41,509 --> 00:13:40,079 on any of them really because they've 381 00:13:42,790 --> 00:13:41,519 got nothing that you can sort of get a 382 00:13:44,470 --> 00:13:42,800 hold of and go right i can actually 383 00:13:45,910 --> 00:13:44,480 chase that down i can you know try and 384 00:13:47,590 --> 00:13:45,920 see if i can sort of get to the bottom 385 00:13:49,670 --> 00:13:47,600 of that i can corroborate it or i can 386 00:13:51,110 --> 00:13:49,680 find somebody you know who's willing to 387 00:13:54,069 --> 00:13:51,120 you know sort of talk about it or 388 00:13:56,230 --> 00:13:54,079 whatever um i tried in vain to actually 389 00:13:58,550 --> 00:13:56,240 talk to robert fleischer uh the german 390 00:13:59,829 --> 00:13:58,560 um um sort of researcher uh you know i 391 00:14:01,189 --> 00:13:59,839 sent him messages and things but i never 392 00:14:02,870 --> 00:14:01,199 got any reply 393 00:14:05,430 --> 00:14:02,880 i understand me he speaks english i 394 00:14:06,629 --> 00:14:05,440 believe but um yeah i i didn't yeah but 395 00:14:07,910 --> 00:14:06,639 i never got anything back from 396 00:14:10,710 --> 00:14:07,920 unfortunately i would be interested to 397 00:14:12,389 --> 00:14:10,720 ask him you know does he have anything 398 00:14:14,230 --> 00:14:12,399 that you know that he that he has on 399 00:14:16,310 --> 00:14:14,240 this subject uh because i thought if 400 00:14:18,470 --> 00:14:16,320 anybody does he would but then again not 401 00:14:20,150 --> 00:14:18,480 everybody looks at this time frame and i 402 00:14:22,150 --> 00:14:20,160 think this is where you know the 403 00:14:23,670 --> 00:14:22,160 problems are just the major problems 404 00:14:25,509 --> 00:14:23,680 beyond what you know what i've just said 405 00:14:27,350 --> 00:14:25,519 there just right across the whole 406 00:14:29,990 --> 00:14:27,360 subject is the time difference so we're 407 00:14:32,550 --> 00:14:30,000 looking at what nearly 80 years ago um 408 00:14:33,990 --> 00:14:32,560 all the people you know who were witness 409 00:14:35,990 --> 00:14:34,000 to these events 410 00:14:38,069 --> 00:14:36,000 probably most of the you know 99 of them 411 00:14:39,670 --> 00:14:38,079 are dead now and the ones that are left 412 00:14:41,990 --> 00:14:39,680 are probably to the point where you 413 00:14:43,189 --> 00:14:42,000 wouldn't necessarily you know probably 414 00:14:44,550 --> 00:14:43,199 be able to get too much in the way of 415 00:14:46,790 --> 00:14:44,560 the ill throw them because their recall 416 00:14:48,790 --> 00:14:46,800 might be so good nowadays the the 417 00:14:49,910 --> 00:14:48,800 chances that we had 418 00:14:52,230 --> 00:14:49,920 you know to actually get this 419 00:14:54,550 --> 00:14:52,240 information from a wider group of people 420 00:14:56,550 --> 00:14:54,560 involved in the war have gone 421 00:14:59,110 --> 00:14:56,560 30 40 years ago when people started you 422 00:15:00,790 --> 00:14:59,120 know started dying um 423 00:15:01,750 --> 00:15:00,800 this book should have been i keep i said 424 00:15:02,870 --> 00:15:01,760 in the book itself it should have been 425 00:15:05,269 --> 00:15:02,880 written 30 426 00:15:06,629 --> 00:15:05,279 years ago uh but also you know 427 00:15:08,470 --> 00:15:06,639 just one of these things you just you 428 00:15:09,750 --> 00:15:08,480 know you can't you can't you just gotta 429 00:15:11,189 --> 00:15:09,760 i can't regret that kind of thing you've 430 00:15:13,670 --> 00:15:11,199 just got to move on and do the best you 431 00:15:16,069 --> 00:15:13,680 can but if if people you know years ago 432 00:15:17,509 --> 00:15:16,079 in the 50s or 60s had had the same kind 433 00:15:19,750 --> 00:15:17,519 of um 434 00:15:22,870 --> 00:15:19,760 sort of like sort of you know desire to 435 00:15:24,150 --> 00:15:22,880 look at those cases um you know as 436 00:15:26,150 --> 00:15:24,160 in addition to the ones that they were 437 00:15:27,750 --> 00:15:26,160 doing like the contemporary cases that 438 00:15:29,189 --> 00:15:27,760 i'm sure they've been much more come out 439 00:15:31,189 --> 00:15:29,199 and they might have found sort of 440 00:15:33,350 --> 00:15:31,199 corroborating witnesses in the squadrons 441 00:15:34,790 --> 00:15:33,360 that could have said yes this happened 442 00:15:36,389 --> 00:15:34,800 and it's not just that you know the 443 00:15:38,629 --> 00:15:36,399 single witness or maybe sometimes two 444 00:15:40,389 --> 00:15:38,639 witnesses from a bomber saying we saw 445 00:15:42,710 --> 00:15:40,399 this and and we're not sure what this 446 00:15:44,870 --> 00:15:42,720 was so that it's a big opportunity 447 00:15:46,949 --> 00:15:44,880 missed but really one of the things i 448 00:15:50,230 --> 00:15:46,959 would love to talk about in a bit is the 449 00:15:52,629 --> 00:15:50,240 reason why this subject sort of fell by 450 00:15:54,710 --> 00:15:52,639 the wayside for at least 50 years uh 451 00:15:56,470 --> 00:15:54,720 until it was sort of picked up a bit so 452 00:15:59,430 --> 00:15:56,480 that's that's quite an interesting story 453 00:16:01,829 --> 00:15:59,440 which i'd love to get across um which is 454 00:16:03,269 --> 00:16:01,839 the real reason why this subject hasn't 455 00:16:05,990 --> 00:16:03,279 probably you know 456 00:16:07,670 --> 00:16:06,000 had the attention it deserves 457 00:16:09,749 --> 00:16:07,680 yeah one thing i've seem to have picked 458 00:16:11,910 --> 00:16:09,759 up on in the last week or two judging by 459 00:16:14,230 --> 00:16:11,920 just the speaking about it and and stuff 460 00:16:16,550 --> 00:16:14,240 is that a lot of the information that 461 00:16:18,790 --> 00:16:16,560 may have been out there publicly there 462 00:16:21,269 --> 00:16:18,800 was a lot of dates and pieces of 463 00:16:23,829 --> 00:16:21,279 information that were actually incorrect 464 00:16:25,749 --> 00:16:23,839 yeah you know so that's that's the yeah 465 00:16:29,110 --> 00:16:25,759 that's keith well keith chester's book 466 00:16:30,629 --> 00:16:29,120 in 2007 strange company um it was it was 467 00:16:32,710 --> 00:16:30,639 great for its day and a lot of people 468 00:16:34,790 --> 00:16:32,720 like it and actually i have it um you 469 00:16:36,870 --> 00:16:34,800 know i think it's still a great book but 470 00:16:39,590 --> 00:16:36,880 it was and it was probably the first one 471 00:16:42,230 --> 00:16:39,600 i'd seen that had a much wider spread of 472 00:16:45,030 --> 00:16:42,240 information than it previously been you 473 00:16:46,710 --> 00:16:45,040 know reported um in in public 474 00:16:48,949 --> 00:16:46,720 unfortunately when i looked started 475 00:16:51,189 --> 00:16:48,959 because i used it as a kind of 476 00:16:52,870 --> 00:16:51,199 as a base for where i could go and what 477 00:16:54,550 --> 00:16:52,880 i could look at if that's even before i 478 00:16:55,670 --> 00:16:54,560 started looking at the book i'll start 479 00:16:56,870 --> 00:16:55,680 checking out some of these things 480 00:16:58,629 --> 00:16:56,880 because i thought well i'm in a good 481 00:17:01,269 --> 00:16:58,639 position here the stuff you know i'm 482 00:17:02,949 --> 00:17:01,279 interested in the access to the um the 483 00:17:05,110 --> 00:17:02,959 sort of data i already have just lying 484 00:17:06,309 --> 00:17:05,120 around at home i could probably work out 485 00:17:08,630 --> 00:17:06,319 some of these whether you know they're 486 00:17:10,309 --> 00:17:08,640 true or not and just just as you know my 487 00:17:13,350 --> 00:17:10,319 own kind of like exercise just as you 488 00:17:16,630 --> 00:17:13,360 know just as a as a way of just checking 489 00:17:18,470 --> 00:17:16,640 um and the more i dig into the stories 490 00:17:20,309 --> 00:17:18,480 the less i can't i kind of found well 491 00:17:22,789 --> 00:17:20,319 actually that's wrong that's wrong you 492 00:17:24,870 --> 00:17:22,799 know there was it was a date of a raid 493 00:17:26,949 --> 00:17:24,880 which didn't take place that night there 494 00:17:28,630 --> 00:17:26,959 was a you know names of witnesses which 495 00:17:32,310 --> 00:17:28,640 were incorrect there wasn't actually 496 00:17:33,669 --> 00:17:32,320 aircraft types that were wrong um so you 497 00:17:36,150 --> 00:17:33,679 know you just wonder what else was kind 498 00:17:38,310 --> 00:17:36,160 of slightly it wasn't anything major but 499 00:17:40,230 --> 00:17:38,320 it just let me sort of think well you 500 00:17:42,310 --> 00:17:40,240 know how much of this book doesn't 501 00:17:43,750 --> 00:17:42,320 actually make sense and i didn't even 502 00:17:45,029 --> 00:17:43,760 look at any specific stuff it was just 503 00:17:47,590 --> 00:17:45,039 the european things i could actually 504 00:17:49,029 --> 00:17:47,600 check so i thought well 505 00:17:50,789 --> 00:17:49,039 you know and i don't like to be too kind 506 00:17:52,310 --> 00:17:50,799 of condescending but it was issues i 507 00:17:54,710 --> 00:17:52,320 just thought well i could probably do a 508 00:17:56,070 --> 00:17:54,720 bit better job than this um certainly 509 00:17:57,669 --> 00:17:56,080 with this kind of thing and just chasing 510 00:17:59,110 --> 00:17:57,679 down you know the names and make sure i 511 00:18:01,110 --> 00:17:59,120 get them from the official records 512 00:18:03,190 --> 00:18:01,120 because that's probably all it needed um 513 00:18:05,270 --> 00:18:03,200 i'm not sure how much kind of background 514 00:18:06,950 --> 00:18:05,280 check that was done on on these kind of 515 00:18:08,710 --> 00:18:06,960 stories and 516 00:18:10,310 --> 00:18:08,720 we can get to some of the hoaxes a bit 517 00:18:12,870 --> 00:18:10,320 later on if you want there are some 518 00:18:13,990 --> 00:18:12,880 stories in that book which i've said and 519 00:18:15,510 --> 00:18:14,000 i think you might have come across them 520 00:18:17,830 --> 00:18:15,520 already which i've said these can't have 521 00:18:19,350 --> 00:18:17,840 happened because such and such wasn't 522 00:18:21,590 --> 00:18:19,360 even in the squadron at the time they 523 00:18:23,110 --> 00:18:21,600 say the work so you know that there are 524 00:18:24,950 --> 00:18:23,120 stories like that and i'll talk about 525 00:18:26,789 --> 00:18:24,960 one of those when you you know as this 526 00:18:28,950 --> 00:18:26,799 extra information i'll i'll mention a 527 00:18:31,029 --> 00:18:28,960 bit later on and it you know because 528 00:18:33,669 --> 00:18:31,039 there's no sacred cows here i don't want 529 00:18:35,190 --> 00:18:33,679 to sort of hold the foo fighters stories 530 00:18:37,590 --> 00:18:35,200 and the witness stories and all that as 531 00:18:39,669 --> 00:18:37,600 being something i can't atta you know i 532 00:18:41,270 --> 00:18:39,679 can't knock down if they're wrong i'm 533 00:18:42,950 --> 00:18:41,280 not going to just you know skip over 534 00:18:44,310 --> 00:18:42,960 them and you know and say oh just forget 535 00:18:46,150 --> 00:18:44,320 about that i'll just push that under the 536 00:18:47,990 --> 00:18:46,160 carpet sort of thing i'll call them out 537 00:18:49,190 --> 00:18:48,000 for what they are because everybody 538 00:18:51,510 --> 00:18:49,200 should do that if you come across 539 00:18:53,750 --> 00:18:51,520 something that's wrong or is this is 540 00:18:55,990 --> 00:18:53,760 being misrepresented in ufology you 541 00:18:57,830 --> 00:18:56,000 should call it out or at least ask 542 00:18:59,750 --> 00:18:57,840 people to actually investigate it and 543 00:19:01,830 --> 00:18:59,760 make sure you know that what's being 544 00:19:03,190 --> 00:19:01,840 said is accurate because the last thing 545 00:19:05,750 --> 00:19:03,200 we'll want to do is making is to be 546 00:19:07,029 --> 00:19:05,760 making conclusions on false information 547 00:19:08,630 --> 00:19:07,039 it doesn't do anybody any good 548 00:19:11,029 --> 00:19:08,640 whatsoever so 549 00:19:11,990 --> 00:19:11,039 no absolutely i mean 550 00:19:13,669 --> 00:19:12,000 it's not 551 00:19:16,150 --> 00:19:13,679 time is not an excuse to forget 552 00:19:18,310 --> 00:19:16,160 important details imagine you look 50 553 00:19:20,470 --> 00:19:18,320 years in the future from now and getting 554 00:19:22,390 --> 00:19:20,480 the name of david fraver alex dietrich 555 00:19:24,390 --> 00:19:22,400 wrong because time has passed and it's 556 00:19:26,710 --> 00:19:24,400 yeah it doesn't matter then it was close 557 00:19:28,870 --> 00:19:26,720 that's vital information it doesn't make 558 00:19:31,350 --> 00:19:28,880 it less important just because time has 559 00:19:33,909 --> 00:19:31,360 passed um i'm going to jump over across 560 00:19:36,390 --> 00:19:33,919 to you dan because um the question i got 561 00:19:38,630 --> 00:19:36,400 for you is in your 562 00:19:40,950 --> 00:19:38,640 growth of looking into ufos over the 563 00:19:43,350 --> 00:19:40,960 past you know 564 00:19:45,990 --> 00:19:43,360 five ten years of of your interest in 565 00:19:48,070 --> 00:19:46,000 the subject where did foo fighters fall 566 00:19:49,830 --> 00:19:48,080 in in like your knowledge base and your 567 00:19:52,390 --> 00:19:49,840 interest base obviously because we all 568 00:19:54,150 --> 00:19:52,400 know 2017 blah blah is that something 569 00:19:55,990 --> 00:19:54,160 you kind of held in your head and 570 00:19:57,590 --> 00:19:56,000 thoughts about and if you had an idea 571 00:19:59,350 --> 00:19:57,600 about it 572 00:20:01,270 --> 00:19:59,360 yeah i mean 573 00:20:03,909 --> 00:20:01,280 the foo fighters is something 574 00:20:05,750 --> 00:20:03,919 you know i grew up on the x-files so 575 00:20:07,430 --> 00:20:05,760 this this stuff is all woven in you know 576 00:20:09,029 --> 00:20:07,440 the outer limits twilight zone all that 577 00:20:11,590 --> 00:20:09,039 kind of stuff so it's definitely 578 00:20:13,510 --> 00:20:11,600 something that's been on my mind um and 579 00:20:15,110 --> 00:20:13,520 these kind of you know these crafted 580 00:20:16,070 --> 00:20:15,120 these balls of light are fascinating 581 00:20:18,390 --> 00:20:16,080 because 582 00:20:19,909 --> 00:20:18,400 going back that far 583 00:20:21,909 --> 00:20:19,919 obviously it can't be modern day 584 00:20:24,310 --> 00:20:21,919 technology we're kind of you know able 585 00:20:26,470 --> 00:20:24,320 to sweep that possibility off the table 586 00:20:28,310 --> 00:20:26,480 um so it just begs the question and 587 00:20:31,029 --> 00:20:28,320 obviously we have better capabilities to 588 00:20:31,909 --> 00:20:31,039 kind of sense and track these things now 589 00:20:34,710 --> 00:20:31,919 so 590 00:20:36,870 --> 00:20:34,720 you know it makes you wonder back then 591 00:20:39,190 --> 00:20:36,880 what what did they see that isn't spoken 592 00:20:40,789 --> 00:20:39,200 about you know um but like graham said 593 00:20:42,230 --> 00:20:40,799 it's really important to push past that 594 00:20:45,110 --> 00:20:42,240 uncomfortable truth because you might 595 00:20:46,710 --> 00:20:45,120 find that sometimes stories and places 596 00:20:49,830 --> 00:20:46,720 have kind of become 597 00:20:51,350 --> 00:20:49,840 you know almost like myth-making um and 598 00:20:52,789 --> 00:20:51,360 we we probably all do it from time to 599 00:20:54,710 --> 00:20:52,799 time you know we're relaying a case and 600 00:20:56,149 --> 00:20:54,720 we just kind of can't remember a detail 601 00:20:58,470 --> 00:20:56,159 that doesn't seem important to us at the 602 00:21:00,549 --> 00:20:58,480 time but that person goes on to spread 603 00:21:03,190 --> 00:21:00,559 that story and so on so forth and then 604 00:21:04,149 --> 00:21:03,200 we end up with something that 605 00:21:05,110 --> 00:21:04,159 you know 606 00:21:06,950 --> 00:21:05,120 is 607 00:21:08,310 --> 00:21:06,960 i mean half the ones with like alien 608 00:21:09,669 --> 00:21:08,320 dolls peeking around the corner and 609 00:21:11,110 --> 00:21:09,679 stuff like that 610 00:21:12,950 --> 00:21:11,120 you know people that put the time into 611 00:21:15,510 --> 00:21:12,960 looking into it know within about five 612 00:21:17,190 --> 00:21:15,520 minutes yeah this is this is nonsense 613 00:21:19,669 --> 00:21:17,200 but other people will just simply take 614 00:21:21,350 --> 00:21:19,679 it on face value and run with it um and 615 00:21:22,470 --> 00:21:21,360 i think it's it's important to be aware 616 00:21:25,510 --> 00:21:22,480 of that and 617 00:21:27,590 --> 00:21:25,520 work like graham's done here is just 618 00:21:29,750 --> 00:21:27,600 fantastic because it gives everyone a 619 00:21:31,029 --> 00:21:29,760 reference and a much better baseline to 620 00:21:33,029 --> 00:21:31,039 start from 621 00:21:35,510 --> 00:21:33,039 yeah i completely agree and i find 622 00:21:37,669 --> 00:21:35,520 myself having to caveat almost every 623 00:21:38,710 --> 00:21:37,679 other sentence i say or write these days 624 00:21:41,270 --> 00:21:38,720 because 625 00:21:42,390 --> 00:21:41,280 semantics and are being really pulled 626 00:21:44,630 --> 00:21:42,400 apart 627 00:21:46,870 --> 00:21:44,640 in very fine detail these days because 628 00:21:49,110 --> 00:21:46,880 if they pick up on a word where it could 629 00:21:51,510 --> 00:21:49,120 mean this could mean that 630 00:21:53,190 --> 00:21:51,520 people will take go to town on on you 631 00:21:54,470 --> 00:21:53,200 meaning that when it was actually that 632 00:21:55,909 --> 00:21:54,480 you know it's 633 00:21:58,549 --> 00:21:55,919 it's brutal it's 634 00:22:00,470 --> 00:21:58,559 it's really brutal so yeah 635 00:22:02,149 --> 00:22:00,480 twitter i mean twitter with 104 or who's 636 00:22:04,390 --> 00:22:02,159 the 280 characters whatever you can 637 00:22:05,830 --> 00:22:04,400 understand why people don't have nuance 638 00:22:07,669 --> 00:22:05,840 you know it's quite a direct form of 639 00:22:08,950 --> 00:22:07,679 communication and people do get things 640 00:22:10,950 --> 00:22:08,960 wrong or there's a kind of 641 00:22:12,870 --> 00:22:10,960 misinterpretation of what people say but 642 00:22:14,789 --> 00:22:12,880 when you've got like a long-form book 643 00:22:16,630 --> 00:22:14,799 you can't do that you have to be 644 00:22:18,310 --> 00:22:16,640 accurate you know you have to stand or 645 00:22:20,230 --> 00:22:18,320 fall on the accuracy of the information 646 00:22:21,830 --> 00:22:20,240 that you've got in it so you know i'm 647 00:22:24,149 --> 00:22:21,840 not just going to put any old rubbish in 648 00:22:26,470 --> 00:22:24,159 there you know i'd check stuff out and 649 00:22:27,830 --> 00:22:26,480 yes okay i may have stuff wrong and i'm 650 00:22:29,430 --> 00:22:27,840 happy for people to come and say look 651 00:22:30,789 --> 00:22:29,440 you know that's incorrect graham and 652 00:22:32,230 --> 00:22:30,799 i'll go away and change it i'll bring 653 00:22:34,149 --> 00:22:32,240 out a different i'll bring out a new 654 00:22:36,549 --> 00:22:34,159 version of it with you know revised 655 00:22:38,710 --> 00:22:36,559 information that's easy enough to do but 656 00:22:40,710 --> 00:22:38,720 i'm pretty confident the stuff that i've 657 00:22:42,390 --> 00:22:40,720 put in is is accurate the sto 658 00:22:43,909 --> 00:22:42,400 everything's referenced as you probably 659 00:22:45,350 --> 00:22:43,919 understand vinnie there's quite a lot of 660 00:22:46,870 --> 00:22:45,360 references in there aren't there 661 00:22:47,990 --> 00:22:46,880 absolutely um 662 00:22:49,310 --> 00:22:48,000 it gets to the point that there's like a 663 00:22:51,990 --> 00:22:49,320 hundred and 664 00:22:54,070 --> 00:22:52,000 154 footnotes i believe so they're all 665 00:22:55,750 --> 00:22:54,080 you know they're all kind of referenced 666 00:22:56,950 --> 00:22:55,760 the sources of information so it's not 667 00:22:59,830 --> 00:22:56,960 like i'm just pulling stuff out of my 668 00:23:01,430 --> 00:22:59,840 head um so it's but i've also done that 669 00:23:03,029 --> 00:23:01,440 as well so if anybody does want to sort 670 00:23:04,470 --> 00:23:03,039 of do what i did with keith chester's 671 00:23:06,070 --> 00:23:04,480 book if they want to go and look at some 672 00:23:08,149 --> 00:23:06,080 of the just pick some stuff at random 673 00:23:09,909 --> 00:23:08,159 from what i've put in and say has graham 674 00:23:11,350 --> 00:23:09,919 got these facts right people can go and 675 00:23:12,950 --> 00:23:11,360 chase down those leads and look for 676 00:23:14,470 --> 00:23:12,960 themselves but actually it's a bit more 677 00:23:16,470 --> 00:23:14,480 than that as well because people can use 678 00:23:17,270 --> 00:23:16,480 that information as a springboard to go 679 00:23:19,510 --> 00:23:17,280 on 680 00:23:21,110 --> 00:23:19,520 and do their own research and say well 681 00:23:22,630 --> 00:23:21,120 you know i can probably do a better job 682 00:23:24,470 --> 00:23:22,640 than graeme has done and i'm happy for 683 00:23:25,830 --> 00:23:24,480 them to do that you know it's not this 684 00:23:27,590 --> 00:23:25,840 is not my subject this is not just 685 00:23:29,350 --> 00:23:27,600 something i want to keep to myself and 686 00:23:31,029 --> 00:23:29,360 go no no you can't research it this is 687 00:23:32,470 --> 00:23:31,039 mine you know this is for everybody it's 688 00:23:33,590 --> 00:23:32,480 not just for me i just happen to be 689 00:23:34,549 --> 00:23:33,600 somebody who wrote a book about it 690 00:23:36,390 --> 00:23:34,559 that's all 691 00:23:38,310 --> 00:23:36,400 yeah i think one thing i always find 692 00:23:40,390 --> 00:23:38,320 myself doing when researching cases and 693 00:23:42,630 --> 00:23:40,400 getting quite deep into them is 694 00:23:44,390 --> 00:23:42,640 placing yourself in in the eyes or the 695 00:23:45,990 --> 00:23:44,400 or the seat of the pilot and because of 696 00:23:47,590 --> 00:23:46,000 what they're saying and that and i've 697 00:23:49,190 --> 00:23:47,600 done that with obviously with the nimitz 698 00:23:51,909 --> 00:23:49,200 case and that with all of the data and 699 00:23:53,830 --> 00:23:51,919 information available i've possibly put 700 00:23:55,190 --> 00:23:53,840 myself in the shoes of robert salas for 701 00:23:58,470 --> 00:23:55,200 example because we know a lot about the 702 00:24:00,390 --> 00:23:58,480 1967 malmstrom air force base case 703 00:24:02,710 --> 00:24:00,400 never in my 704 00:24:05,750 --> 00:24:02,720 decade of researching have i ever been 705 00:24:08,950 --> 00:24:05,760 able to do that with cases pre roswell 706 00:24:10,789 --> 00:24:08,960 but when i read your book or so far i've 707 00:24:13,110 --> 00:24:10,799 actually placed myself in the shoes of 708 00:24:14,789 --> 00:24:13,120 those people involved in those cases 709 00:24:16,789 --> 00:24:14,799 and it's so incredible to be able to do 710 00:24:18,149 --> 00:24:16,799 that for the first time 711 00:24:19,750 --> 00:24:18,159 it's never been done before in that 712 00:24:21,669 --> 00:24:19,760 detail on that and that's a massive 713 00:24:23,269 --> 00:24:21,679 thing i really wanted to 714 00:24:25,990 --> 00:24:23,279 to tell you about graham that you've 715 00:24:27,909 --> 00:24:26,000 been able to take us back even further 716 00:24:29,590 --> 00:24:27,919 and really get an idea of what it might 717 00:24:31,909 --> 00:24:29,600 have been like because it 718 00:24:34,549 --> 00:24:31,919 seemed like it was really scary to be in 719 00:24:36,630 --> 00:24:34,559 those really basic aircraft with 720 00:24:38,870 --> 00:24:36,640 the weapon systems and and what the 721 00:24:40,470 --> 00:24:38,880 possibilities have could go wrong 722 00:24:42,870 --> 00:24:40,480 you know when the technology wasn't 723 00:24:45,029 --> 00:24:42,880 really there like it is today you know 724 00:24:46,149 --> 00:24:45,039 i felt it was important i mean that's i 725 00:24:48,149 --> 00:24:46,159 do try and set the scene at the 726 00:24:49,990 --> 00:24:48,159 beginning of the book in terms of what 727 00:24:51,909 --> 00:24:50,000 it was like to be in a bomber flying 728 00:24:54,149 --> 00:24:51,919 over germany with fairly rudimentary 729 00:24:55,990 --> 00:24:54,159 navigation aids bombing aids and all the 730 00:24:58,390 --> 00:24:56,000 rest of it just to give some people an 731 00:24:59,990 --> 00:24:58,400 idea of what it was like for the crew 732 00:25:01,350 --> 00:25:00,000 not just seeing all these strange 733 00:25:03,430 --> 00:25:01,360 objects and lights that they were seeing 734 00:25:05,029 --> 00:25:03,440 but just the day-to-day kind of you know 735 00:25:06,390 --> 00:25:05,039 some of it was monotony some of it was 736 00:25:08,870 --> 00:25:06,400 terror some of it was somewhere in 737 00:25:10,870 --> 00:25:08,880 between um just flying to germany and 738 00:25:12,470 --> 00:25:10,880 back you know was it was an ordeal even 739 00:25:14,549 --> 00:25:12,480 without all the rest of it without being 740 00:25:15,510 --> 00:25:14,559 shot down or attacked by night fighters 741 00:25:18,470 --> 00:25:15,520 or having something wrong with the 742 00:25:19,750 --> 00:25:18,480 aircraft all the rest of it um so you 743 00:25:20,789 --> 00:25:19,760 know they had all that to contend with 744 00:25:22,789 --> 00:25:20,799 and then of course there's all this 745 00:25:24,950 --> 00:25:22,799 other strange stuff that goes on as well 746 00:25:26,310 --> 00:25:24,960 um so yeah putting yourself in the shoes 747 00:25:27,990 --> 00:25:26,320 of the people who were there you know 748 00:25:28,870 --> 00:25:28,000 well not in the ground but on the air so 749 00:25:30,710 --> 00:25:28,880 to speak 750 00:25:33,190 --> 00:25:30,720 it is it's something that it's difficult 751 00:25:35,269 --> 00:25:33,200 sometimes for an author to get across um 752 00:25:38,710 --> 00:25:35,279 especially for somebody like me who 753 00:25:40,230 --> 00:25:38,720 sort of has had what 40 45 years um you 754 00:25:42,789 --> 00:25:40,240 know looking at this kind of stuff so 755 00:25:44,390 --> 00:25:42,799 i'm quite well versed with it um so you 756 00:25:45,590 --> 00:25:44,400 know in my head i'm i'm you know i'm 757 00:25:47,909 --> 00:25:45,600 pretty confident about i know what i'm 758 00:25:49,350 --> 00:25:47,919 looking at and and how this all would 759 00:25:51,269 --> 00:25:49,360 probably look and how it would play out 760 00:25:53,269 --> 00:25:51,279 for the people on the ground putting it 761 00:25:55,430 --> 00:25:53,279 to some you know maybe trying to write 762 00:25:57,110 --> 00:25:55,440 it down for somebody like you or for dan 763 00:25:59,269 --> 00:25:57,120 or for somebody else it's a different 764 00:26:01,350 --> 00:25:59,279 thing entirely and i'm you know you 765 00:26:03,190 --> 00:26:01,360 never know how it's that you succeed in 766 00:26:04,470 --> 00:26:03,200 that so i'm really pleased that you felt 767 00:26:06,549 --> 00:26:04,480 that you know something i managed to 768 00:26:08,310 --> 00:26:06,559 achieve so yeah i'm really happy about 769 00:26:10,470 --> 00:26:08,320 that thank you now it's just a different 770 00:26:11,750 --> 00:26:10,480 angle because we can all read stories 771 00:26:15,830 --> 00:26:11,760 and 772 00:26:17,830 --> 00:26:15,840 great data that's great information but 773 00:26:20,630 --> 00:26:17,840 you know i like it when you can 774 00:26:22,549 --> 00:26:20,640 drift off and imagine yourself in 775 00:26:24,630 --> 00:26:22,559 those places you know or in those 776 00:26:26,789 --> 00:26:24,640 aeroplanes or in those 777 00:26:30,230 --> 00:26:26,799 battles or situations where you have to 778 00:26:32,789 --> 00:26:30,240 make split decisions with rudimentary 779 00:26:34,390 --> 00:26:32,799 air vehicles like you know 780 00:26:35,830 --> 00:26:34,400 um so 781 00:26:37,990 --> 00:26:35,840 yeah that's what really grabbed me 782 00:26:39,029 --> 00:26:38,000 really early on so yeah i think that's a 783 00:26:40,070 --> 00:26:39,039 huge thing 784 00:26:47,990 --> 00:26:40,080 um 785 00:26:49,110 --> 00:26:48,000 the production of the entire thing 786 00:26:52,549 --> 00:26:49,120 when 787 00:26:54,149 --> 00:26:52,559 you and graham were talking and 788 00:26:55,990 --> 00:26:54,159 i mean this is probably what i want to 789 00:26:57,590 --> 00:26:56,000 come to when did 790 00:26:58,870 --> 00:26:57,600 did you and olaf come into this together 791 00:27:01,110 --> 00:26:58,880 or was it something that was brought to 792 00:27:03,190 --> 00:27:01,120 you first bef and then olaf got involved 793 00:27:05,590 --> 00:27:03,200 after the fact like how did 794 00:27:06,470 --> 00:27:05,600 how did it really break down 795 00:27:09,269 --> 00:27:06,480 so 796 00:27:10,470 --> 00:27:09,279 graeme shared what he was working on 797 00:27:12,710 --> 00:27:10,480 um 798 00:27:14,870 --> 00:27:12,720 at which point in the conversation i 799 00:27:15,909 --> 00:27:14,880 asked him kind of for a for a standout 800 00:27:18,230 --> 00:27:15,919 story 801 00:27:19,590 --> 00:27:18,240 because yeah i knew at some point he 802 00:27:20,710 --> 00:27:19,600 knew that he'd need to cover and i 803 00:27:21,990 --> 00:27:20,720 thought you know it might it might be 804 00:27:23,830 --> 00:27:22,000 cool to kind of 805 00:27:26,149 --> 00:27:23,840 see what all often i can come up with 806 00:27:26,950 --> 00:27:26,159 because we we'd kind of become friends 807 00:27:28,710 --> 00:27:26,960 and 808 00:27:30,230 --> 00:27:28,720 we always kind of run our art past each 809 00:27:32,789 --> 00:27:30,240 other and you know he'll feed back to my 810 00:27:33,669 --> 00:27:32,799 stuff and i'll do the same um so you 811 00:27:35,190 --> 00:27:33,679 know it's kind of cool to 812 00:27:37,590 --> 00:27:35,200 cross-pollinate but we'd never really 813 00:27:39,830 --> 00:27:37,600 done something full-on collaboration so 814 00:27:41,510 --> 00:27:39,840 i was like oh this could be quite a cool 815 00:27:43,350 --> 00:27:41,520 first project you know so i sent it to 816 00:27:45,029 --> 00:27:43,360 him and we just 817 00:27:46,230 --> 00:27:45,039 left it after the suggestion you know 818 00:27:48,310 --> 00:27:46,240 what one of those things you know what 819 00:27:50,549 --> 00:27:48,320 projects are like you you have ten go in 820 00:27:52,630 --> 00:27:50,559 and only nine come to fruition but the 821 00:27:54,870 --> 00:27:52,640 one kind of perks up at some point and 822 00:27:56,789 --> 00:27:54,880 it becomes a complete thing um but it 823 00:27:58,870 --> 00:27:56,799 just so happened that the 824 00:28:00,789 --> 00:27:58,880 the morning where graham kind of 825 00:28:03,830 --> 00:28:00,799 formally asked 826 00:28:06,070 --> 00:28:03,840 me if i do some art was the same morning 827 00:28:08,230 --> 00:28:06,080 where olaf and i had kind of 828 00:28:09,909 --> 00:28:08,240 found the you know the second wind of 829 00:28:11,190 --> 00:28:09,919 creating it so we've been kind of you 830 00:28:12,710 --> 00:28:11,200 know pulling a few references and 831 00:28:15,029 --> 00:28:12,720 talking about what we do kind of in 832 00:28:16,870 --> 00:28:15,039 detail um yeah and as soon as graham 833 00:28:18,230 --> 00:28:16,880 asked us then it was just like cool 834 00:28:19,750 --> 00:28:18,240 we're kind of 835 00:28:21,750 --> 00:28:19,760 this this is you know i'm not going to 836 00:28:23,350 --> 00:28:21,760 tell you what we're doing but 837 00:28:25,430 --> 00:28:23,360 we've been working on it for a while and 838 00:28:27,430 --> 00:28:25,440 this is kind of serendipitous you know 839 00:28:29,830 --> 00:28:27,440 it was very very cold the way it came 840 00:28:32,070 --> 00:28:29,840 about um and 841 00:28:33,510 --> 00:28:32,080 actually creating it was uh it was it 842 00:28:35,430 --> 00:28:33,520 was an absolute pleasure to do that with 843 00:28:38,389 --> 00:28:35,440 olaf to kind of you know entangle 844 00:28:41,110 --> 00:28:38,399 creatively um 845 00:28:42,710 --> 00:28:41,120 yeah it's hard to 846 00:28:44,470 --> 00:28:42,720 in conversations we've had we've both 847 00:28:46,710 --> 00:28:44,480 said that it doesn't really feel like 848 00:28:48,870 --> 00:28:46,720 our work it kind of feels like you know 849 00:28:51,510 --> 00:28:48,880 a baby of both our work and i think you 850 00:28:54,230 --> 00:28:51,520 can see that as well yeah absolutely and 851 00:28:56,789 --> 00:28:54,240 but the thing is as well it just 852 00:28:58,870 --> 00:28:56,799 it showed me you know i've been a fan of 853 00:29:01,590 --> 00:28:58,880 both of you guys for us for some time 854 00:29:03,430 --> 00:29:01,600 and the whole uap media thing because it 855 00:29:05,269 --> 00:29:03,440 it feels like everyone was an important 856 00:29:07,590 --> 00:29:05,279 piece of of the puzzle almost like 857 00:29:09,190 --> 00:29:07,600 voltron you know you've got the head 858 00:29:10,789 --> 00:29:09,200 it really did 859 00:29:14,070 --> 00:29:10,799 and it's shown to me now being a part of 860 00:29:16,549 --> 00:29:14,080 it that i see it on a regular basis that 861 00:29:19,029 --> 00:29:16,559 you know everyone's got their strengths 862 00:29:20,149 --> 00:29:19,039 in their in their main field but they've 863 00:29:21,350 --> 00:29:20,159 also got strengths in all the other 864 00:29:23,110 --> 00:29:21,360 fields of everyone else and the 865 00:29:23,909 --> 00:29:23,120 intertwining of the conversations and 866 00:29:25,830 --> 00:29:23,919 that 867 00:29:27,669 --> 00:29:25,840 brings out some of the best and most 868 00:29:28,789 --> 00:29:27,679 interesting details in conversation that 869 00:29:33,029 --> 00:29:28,799 i've 870 00:29:35,029 --> 00:29:33,039 um but i'm sure there can't be any 871 00:29:36,710 --> 00:29:35,039 better so you know that 872 00:29:38,389 --> 00:29:36,720 it's just yet another compliment i have 873 00:29:40,310 --> 00:29:38,399 to bring 874 00:29:43,110 --> 00:29:40,320 to the plate because of you guys and and 875 00:29:45,029 --> 00:29:43,120 we can't forget everyone else and adam 876 00:29:48,230 --> 00:29:45,039 dave andy chris 877 00:29:50,230 --> 00:29:48,240 is just fantastic man and then 878 00:29:54,950 --> 00:29:50,240 so yeah so 879 00:29:57,430 --> 00:29:56,070 i'm i'm trying to think of something 880 00:29:58,950 --> 00:29:57,440 that i can ask you that hasn't been 881 00:30:00,950 --> 00:29:58,960 hasn't been spoken about you mentioned 882 00:30:02,950 --> 00:30:00,960 earlier that you could talk about maybe 883 00:30:04,389 --> 00:30:02,960 a case or cases that you haven't 884 00:30:05,669 --> 00:30:04,399 mentioned before 885 00:30:07,190 --> 00:30:05,679 is there an angle that you can come out 886 00:30:10,230 --> 00:30:07,200 with that with that kind of thing 887 00:30:11,590 --> 00:30:10,240 something that he relates to 888 00:30:12,870 --> 00:30:11,600 well 889 00:30:14,549 --> 00:30:12,880 i'll tell you i'll talk about the i'll 890 00:30:16,230 --> 00:30:14,559 tell i'll talk about the hooks element 891 00:30:18,149 --> 00:30:16,240 okay that's all right i'll talk about 892 00:30:18,950 --> 00:30:18,159 that thing so this is the kind of you 893 00:30:20,389 --> 00:30:18,960 know 894 00:30:22,310 --> 00:30:20,399 the depth of how to go to just to make 895 00:30:24,549 --> 00:30:22,320 sure that these cases that i was reading 896 00:30:27,430 --> 00:30:24,559 about um that all were already 897 00:30:31,269 --> 00:30:27,440 percolating into the kind of ufo press 898 00:30:33,590 --> 00:30:31,279 um in the sort of 1990s um at the end of 899 00:30:35,430 --> 00:30:33,600 this kind of like kind of strange period 900 00:30:37,029 --> 00:30:35,440 of 50 years where you know the through 901 00:30:40,549 --> 00:30:37,039 fighters have basically just got a bad 902 00:30:43,669 --> 00:30:40,559 press from or no press from ufology as 903 00:30:46,549 --> 00:30:43,679 ryan said uh on his own show um on when 904 00:30:49,190 --> 00:30:46,559 was it it was um friday night he 905 00:30:50,710 --> 00:30:49,200 mentioned that um you know you follow 906 00:30:52,070 --> 00:30:50,720 ufology is basically just tr you know 907 00:30:53,990 --> 00:30:52,080 the foo fighters as though probably they 908 00:30:55,990 --> 00:30:54,000 didn't exist it was just skipped over 909 00:30:58,470 --> 00:30:56,000 you know in a lot of press uh in books 910 00:30:59,750 --> 00:30:58,480 that were in the 50s 60s 70s 80s uh or 911 00:31:01,430 --> 00:30:59,760 if they did they just got like you know 912 00:31:02,630 --> 00:31:01,440 a couple of lines and let's move on to 913 00:31:05,269 --> 00:31:02,640 the ghost rockets let's move on to 914 00:31:08,549 --> 00:31:05,279 kenneth arnold so there was quite a you 915 00:31:10,389 --> 00:31:08,559 know just nothing but if you read some 916 00:31:12,389 --> 00:31:10,399 like some of the kind of like limited 917 00:31:14,789 --> 00:31:12,399 circulation newsletters like flying 918 00:31:16,710 --> 00:31:14,799 saucer review uh and some others then 919 00:31:18,149 --> 00:31:16,720 there were you know little fragments of 920 00:31:19,990 --> 00:31:18,159 information just kept popping up every 921 00:31:21,509 --> 00:31:20,000 so often but they were never chased down 922 00:31:23,909 --> 00:31:21,519 at all so 923 00:31:26,149 --> 00:31:23,919 the the only kind of narrative of this 924 00:31:28,789 --> 00:31:26,159 50 years is from that original american 925 00:31:30,870 --> 00:31:28,799 legion article from december 1945 that 926 00:31:32,549 --> 00:31:30,880 was written by an aide to the the head 927 00:31:35,190 --> 00:31:32,559 of the u.s air force 928 00:31:37,110 --> 00:31:35,200 um and he got the story this this this 929 00:31:39,110 --> 00:31:37,120 officer had got the stories from the the 930 00:31:41,590 --> 00:31:39,120 some of the airmen in europe uh who was 931 00:31:42,870 --> 00:31:41,600 actually embedded with so um 932 00:31:44,710 --> 00:31:42,880 that was the basic the only source 933 00:31:46,789 --> 00:31:44,720 material that most ufologists and people 934 00:31:49,110 --> 00:31:46,799 writing books and magazines had to go on 935 00:31:50,789 --> 00:31:49,120 for about 50 years until a group of 936 00:31:53,269 --> 00:31:50,799 researchers in the states and then in 937 00:31:54,630 --> 00:31:53,279 the mid-90s started actually accessing 938 00:31:56,549 --> 00:31:54,640 the the war diaries of some of the 939 00:31:58,070 --> 00:31:56,559 squadrons um the american light fighter 940 00:32:00,149 --> 00:31:58,080 squadrons who were you know seeing these 941 00:32:01,590 --> 00:32:00,159 things over europe in over the winter 44 942 00:32:03,830 --> 00:32:01,600 45 943 00:32:06,630 --> 00:32:03,840 but in the meantime some stories were 944 00:32:07,590 --> 00:32:06,640 coming through and tim goode had a story 945 00:32:10,549 --> 00:32:07,600 um 946 00:32:13,110 --> 00:32:10,559 of uh of a sighting which in may 1943 947 00:32:16,310 --> 00:32:13,120 over germany and then nick redford 948 00:32:17,990 --> 00:32:16,320 redfin also had another story um now 949 00:32:19,110 --> 00:32:18,000 what an author i'm not going to say who 950 00:32:20,389 --> 00:32:19,120 it is 951 00:32:22,149 --> 00:32:20,399 actually 952 00:32:24,549 --> 00:32:22,159 included a story in one of their books 953 00:32:27,190 --> 00:32:24,559 and it's a fairly famous british author 954 00:32:29,590 --> 00:32:27,200 um had a story in one of his books about 955 00:32:31,750 --> 00:32:29,600 a it was just after d-day and this 956 00:32:33,110 --> 00:32:31,760 gentleman said he was a pilot 957 00:32:34,710 --> 00:32:33,120 and they were you know they published 958 00:32:37,430 --> 00:32:34,720 this this account of him sitting at a 959 00:32:39,509 --> 00:32:37,440 debriefing table after a raid uh against 960 00:32:40,630 --> 00:32:39,519 uh stuttgart and it was the second of 961 00:32:41,990 --> 00:32:40,640 three 962 00:32:45,430 --> 00:32:42,000 more or less consecutive raids on the 963 00:32:47,669 --> 00:32:45,440 city um just after d-day um and he said 964 00:32:49,190 --> 00:32:47,679 that he'd whitney heard overheard a 965 00:32:50,789 --> 00:32:49,200 conversation at the next table because 966 00:32:51,990 --> 00:32:50,799 every you bear in mind all the bomber 967 00:32:54,070 --> 00:32:52,000 crews when they used to come back to the 968 00:32:55,909 --> 00:32:54,080 base before they could even go and you 969 00:32:57,750 --> 00:32:55,919 know have a cup of tea whatever you know 970 00:32:59,430 --> 00:32:57,760 on one unwind they had to go and sit in 971 00:33:00,630 --> 00:32:59,440 front of an intelligence officer and 972 00:33:02,230 --> 00:33:00,640 basically get debriefed about the 973 00:33:04,230 --> 00:33:02,240 mission so it was a case of you know 974 00:33:06,549 --> 00:33:04,240 what time did you take off uh did you 975 00:33:07,990 --> 00:33:06,559 see any searchlights i or and flack on 976 00:33:10,470 --> 00:33:08,000 route did you drop your bombs at the 977 00:33:12,230 --> 00:33:10,480 right time what altitude did he do that 978 00:33:13,909 --> 00:33:12,240 from uh what did you see any night 979 00:33:15,669 --> 00:33:13,919 fighters all this kind of stuff the 980 00:33:17,750 --> 00:33:15,679 stuff that would be helpful for the next 981 00:33:19,750 --> 00:33:17,760 raid or further raids working out what 982 00:33:20,789 --> 00:33:19,760 the germans were doing it was always the 983 00:33:23,430 --> 00:33:20,799 case it didn't matter whether you were 984 00:33:24,549 --> 00:33:23,440 bomber fighter anti-submarine aircraft 985 00:33:27,110 --> 00:33:24,559 all the crews have these kind of 986 00:33:29,350 --> 00:33:27,120 debriefings so anyway this guy's sitting 987 00:33:30,310 --> 00:33:29,360 at a table his crew that they're talking 988 00:33:32,389 --> 00:33:30,320 through the mission with this 989 00:33:34,070 --> 00:33:32,399 intelligence officer next table another 990 00:33:36,070 --> 00:33:34,080 crew said the exact same thing and this 991 00:33:38,310 --> 00:33:36,080 guy this pilot overhears this 992 00:33:39,530 --> 00:33:38,320 conversation about a crew being chased 993 00:33:41,990 --> 00:33:39,540 by a light 994 00:33:43,669 --> 00:33:42,000 [Music] 995 00:33:44,789 --> 00:33:43,679 excuse me 996 00:33:49,509 --> 00:33:44,799 so 997 00:33:55,590 --> 00:33:49,519 man you're excused 998 00:33:58,710 --> 00:33:57,430 it's not age man i do all the time you 999 00:34:00,230 --> 00:33:58,720 know yeah 1000 00:34:02,549 --> 00:34:00,240 so 1001 00:34:04,310 --> 00:34:02,559 here's a story and that's what gets put 1002 00:34:06,230 --> 00:34:04,320 into this book 1003 00:34:07,830 --> 00:34:06,240 and you have the name of the pilot who 1004 00:34:09,510 --> 00:34:07,840 overheard the conversation he even had 1005 00:34:11,109 --> 00:34:09,520 the squadron he was with now that's 1006 00:34:13,030 --> 00:34:11,119 information you could go to the the 1007 00:34:14,069 --> 00:34:13,040 records in kew guard in kew gardens in 1008 00:34:15,829 --> 00:34:14,079 london 1009 00:34:17,349 --> 00:34:15,839 and find that information 1010 00:34:18,790 --> 00:34:17,359 and for some reason 1011 00:34:20,069 --> 00:34:18,800 somebody hasn't done that and they've 1012 00:34:21,589 --> 00:34:20,079 just put the story straight in the book 1013 00:34:24,470 --> 00:34:21,599 or if they have they haven't gone that 1014 00:34:25,750 --> 00:34:24,480 deep into the into the story because 1015 00:34:27,589 --> 00:34:25,760 as soon as i looked at the the crew 1016 00:34:28,629 --> 00:34:27,599 manifests for the for the squadron for 1017 00:34:30,310 --> 00:34:28,639 that month 1018 00:34:31,909 --> 00:34:30,320 i i found where the raids were well 1019 00:34:33,589 --> 00:34:31,919 there actually weren't when he said they 1020 00:34:36,310 --> 00:34:33,599 were seven weeks afterwards they were in 1021 00:34:38,389 --> 00:34:36,320 july 1944 rather than june 1944 when 1022 00:34:39,510 --> 00:34:38,399 d-day was on so that sort of made me 1023 00:34:40,869 --> 00:34:39,520 think okay well there might be a bit 1024 00:34:42,470 --> 00:34:40,879 more to this so 1025 00:34:44,389 --> 00:34:42,480 looked in the squad got the swagman 1026 00:34:45,990 --> 00:34:44,399 records you can see the manifest so you 1027 00:34:47,109 --> 00:34:46,000 can see which crew which which aircraft 1028 00:34:49,589 --> 00:34:47,119 which raid 1029 00:34:51,430 --> 00:34:49,599 well that the second stuff got raid he 1030 00:34:53,430 --> 00:34:51,440 was all he wasn't on 1031 00:34:54,869 --> 00:34:53,440 um i looked right through the month and 1032 00:34:56,310 --> 00:34:54,879 he was only in the first day of that 1033 00:34:58,230 --> 00:34:56,320 month and then he just disappeared from 1034 00:34:59,829 --> 00:34:58,240 the squadron that name 1035 00:35:01,349 --> 00:34:59,839 and here's the next bit 1036 00:35:03,589 --> 00:35:01,359 here's the best bit though he wasn't 1037 00:35:05,750 --> 00:35:03,599 even a pilot he was a flight engineer 1038 00:35:07,030 --> 00:35:05,760 so you know and i can chat and i checked 1039 00:35:08,390 --> 00:35:07,040 that and there was actually a list of 1040 00:35:10,150 --> 00:35:08,400 all and that just wasn't through the 1041 00:35:12,230 --> 00:35:10,160 squadron records there was a list of all 1042 00:35:14,230 --> 00:35:12,240 the the crew on the squadron uh broken 1043 00:35:15,430 --> 00:35:14,240 down into cruise and that was a separate 1044 00:35:17,430 --> 00:35:15,440 document and i found that and it said 1045 00:35:19,109 --> 00:35:17,440 yeah he's a flight engineer um he was 1046 00:35:21,510 --> 00:35:19,119 listed second on each crew which meant 1047 00:35:23,670 --> 00:35:21,520 he was a flight engineer so he wasn't a 1048 00:35:25,270 --> 00:35:23,680 pilot what he was saying was wrong he 1049 00:35:26,470 --> 00:35:25,280 wasn't even on the squadron at the time 1050 00:35:27,990 --> 00:35:26,480 he wasn't flying missions so there was 1051 00:35:29,990 --> 00:35:28,000 no way he would have been in the debris 1052 00:35:33,109 --> 00:35:30,000 room you know sitting with a crew 1053 00:35:35,430 --> 00:35:33,119 talking to an um an intelligence officer 1054 00:35:37,670 --> 00:35:35,440 to overhear another another man's kind 1055 00:35:40,150 --> 00:35:37,680 of account so something didn't add up 1056 00:35:42,150 --> 00:35:40,160 here um so i just say that in the book 1057 00:35:44,390 --> 00:35:42,160 you know say well sorry this story 1058 00:35:45,990 --> 00:35:44,400 didn't either didn't happen or it didn't 1059 00:35:48,870 --> 00:35:46,000 happen in the way he said it did because 1060 00:35:50,790 --> 00:35:48,880 what he's saying is wrong on two counts 1061 00:35:52,630 --> 00:35:50,800 so what else is wrong with it 1062 00:35:54,790 --> 00:35:52,640 you know so wow it's important these 1063 00:35:56,470 --> 00:35:54,800 things are are basically sort of you 1064 00:35:58,310 --> 00:35:56,480 know sort of put out there because i 1065 00:36:00,310 --> 00:35:58,320 don't want people just to regurgitate 1066 00:36:02,069 --> 00:36:00,320 these same stories and say i'm sorry you 1067 00:36:04,630 --> 00:36:02,079 know because you do have to go along and 1068 00:36:06,069 --> 00:36:04,640 say once that's wrong and and that's it 1069 00:36:07,510 --> 00:36:06,079 and that's not the only one in the book 1070 00:36:09,270 --> 00:36:07,520 i've got quite a few others where i've 1071 00:36:11,109 --> 00:36:09,280 looked at them and these are accounts 1072 00:36:13,510 --> 00:36:11,119 that have either been in 1073 00:36:15,829 --> 00:36:13,520 english language books or in a couple of 1074 00:36:17,670 --> 00:36:15,839 cases french language books there are 1075 00:36:19,589 --> 00:36:17,680 quite a few stories in there some of 1076 00:36:22,230 --> 00:36:19,599 which are not 100 1077 00:36:24,069 --> 00:36:22,240 and one or two are admitted hoaxes on 1078 00:36:26,550 --> 00:36:24,079 behalf of the author who actually put 1079 00:36:28,230 --> 00:36:26,560 them in his book in the first place yeah 1080 00:36:30,470 --> 00:36:28,240 and did you did you find that you had to 1081 00:36:32,470 --> 00:36:30,480 translate yourself a lot of 1082 00:36:35,030 --> 00:36:32,480 or some information did you english 1083 00:36:37,190 --> 00:36:35,040 german italian yeah quite a few source 1084 00:36:38,710 --> 00:36:37,200 documents uh and books and all the rest 1085 00:36:40,950 --> 00:36:38,720 of it and some of these books go back 1086 00:36:43,030 --> 00:36:40,960 sort of 50 years you know some of the 1087 00:36:46,150 --> 00:36:43,040 french books are from the early 1970s 1088 00:36:48,069 --> 00:36:46,160 the italian books are from the 1960s so 1089 00:36:49,670 --> 00:36:48,079 they go back a long long way 1090 00:36:51,349 --> 00:36:49,680 what process did you use because i was 1091 00:36:53,109 --> 00:36:51,359 having a chat on instagram earlier on a 1092 00:36:55,190 --> 00:36:53,119 live talking about italian cases i've 1093 00:36:57,510 --> 00:36:55,200 looked into and and had to use google 1094 00:36:59,190 --> 00:36:57,520 translate and yeah you automatically 1095 00:37:00,950 --> 00:36:59,200 know as soon as the translation comes 1096 00:37:02,790 --> 00:37:00,960 through that it's not done a good job in 1097 00:37:05,190 --> 00:37:02,800 the translation you kind of you get a 1098 00:37:07,430 --> 00:37:05,200 sense of what's there though um you know 1099 00:37:09,190 --> 00:37:07,440 you might not get 100 but you get enough 1100 00:37:10,150 --> 00:37:09,200 that you can look at stuff and go yeah 1101 00:37:11,270 --> 00:37:10,160 and then actually if you run it 1102 00:37:13,190 --> 00:37:11,280 backwards and forwards occasionally 1103 00:37:15,750 --> 00:37:13,200 sometimes it actually sort of 1104 00:37:18,150 --> 00:37:15,760 um ends itself out but also some of 1105 00:37:19,510 --> 00:37:18,160 these things were also um in other 1106 00:37:20,790 --> 00:37:19,520 documents so they were in like another 1107 00:37:22,390 --> 00:37:20,800 newsletter like another french 1108 00:37:24,310 --> 00:37:22,400 newsletter or another italian book or 1109 00:37:26,150 --> 00:37:24,320 whatever so then you just got multiple 1110 00:37:27,910 --> 00:37:26,160 kind of versions of the same story and 1111 00:37:29,430 --> 00:37:27,920 the more you run it through you know 1112 00:37:31,270 --> 00:37:29,440 from different sources you've got a 1113 00:37:33,990 --> 00:37:31,280 picture of yeah okay this is really what 1114 00:37:34,870 --> 00:37:34,000 they're saying um so yeah that's what it 1115 00:37:36,950 --> 00:37:34,880 was 1116 00:37:38,470 --> 00:37:36,960 that's the way i did it but you didn't 1117 00:37:40,710 --> 00:37:38,480 really need to have it 1118 00:37:43,430 --> 00:37:40,720 pinned down too accurately to work out 1119 00:37:45,270 --> 00:37:43,440 the kind of gist of what was going on um 1120 00:37:46,550 --> 00:37:45,280 just to work out where they were talking 1121 00:37:48,710 --> 00:37:46,560 you know whether they were talking about 1122 00:37:49,750 --> 00:37:48,720 a real event or not um and some of the 1123 00:37:52,230 --> 00:37:49,760 things you had to actually fill in the 1124 00:37:53,910 --> 00:37:52,240 blanks you know yourself or myself 1125 00:37:55,750 --> 00:37:53,920 rather but that didn't mean to say that 1126 00:37:56,630 --> 00:37:55,760 i was making stuff up it was just a kind 1127 00:37:58,790 --> 00:37:56,640 of 1128 00:38:00,790 --> 00:37:58,800 a process where i was looking at the 1129 00:38:02,630 --> 00:38:00,800 information and trying to say okay yeah 1130 00:38:04,230 --> 00:38:02,640 that's what they're talking about they 1131 00:38:06,230 --> 00:38:04,240 might not have the exact terminology 1132 00:38:07,910 --> 00:38:06,240 down but i know what that terminology is 1133 00:38:09,430 --> 00:38:07,920 so i can just substitute that word sort 1134 00:38:10,470 --> 00:38:09,440 of thing or you know that kind of thing 1135 00:38:11,990 --> 00:38:10,480 so they might be talking about a 1136 00:38:13,990 --> 00:38:12,000 particular type of german aircraft they 1137 00:38:15,349 --> 00:38:14,000 haven't got the actually the terminology 1138 00:38:16,870 --> 00:38:15,359 quite right but i know i know exactly 1139 00:38:18,310 --> 00:38:16,880 what they're talking about i suppose 1140 00:38:19,750 --> 00:38:18,320 yeah because numbers translate quite 1141 00:38:22,230 --> 00:38:19,760 well whether it be dates maybe it would 1142 00:38:23,750 --> 00:38:22,240 be numbers like aircraft numbers like 1143 00:38:24,870 --> 00:38:23,760 you know um 1144 00:38:26,870 --> 00:38:24,880 the number of the plane whatever it 1145 00:38:28,630 --> 00:38:26,880 would be like 14 in f16 obviously it's 1146 00:38:29,670 --> 00:38:28,640 not that bad you see where i'm coming 1147 00:38:31,190 --> 00:38:29,680 from then 1148 00:38:32,630 --> 00:38:31,200 so let's jump back to you dan because 1149 00:38:34,470 --> 00:38:32,640 you know i could speak to grandma today 1150 00:38:36,710 --> 00:38:34,480 but you're just as an integral part of 1151 00:38:38,390 --> 00:38:36,720 this process as as 1152 00:38:39,750 --> 00:38:38,400 i mean i i could just listen to graham 1153 00:38:41,510 --> 00:38:39,760 talk about the food fighter stuff all 1154 00:38:43,910 --> 00:38:41,520 day i i really i really hope that 1155 00:38:45,670 --> 00:38:43,920 audiobooks come and graham 1156 00:38:46,790 --> 00:38:45,680 yeah but i'm i'm not going to write i'm 1157 00:38:48,790 --> 00:38:46,800 not going to read it because nobody will 1158 00:38:51,430 --> 00:38:48,800 understand what the hell i'm saying uh 1159 00:38:54,470 --> 00:38:51,440 it's an air man i disagree i i think i 1160 00:38:55,990 --> 00:38:54,480 like your accent man i i do 1161 00:38:58,630 --> 00:38:56,000 it would be really nice to kind of have 1162 00:38:59,670 --> 00:38:58,640 like a a mix of accents reading the book 1163 00:39:01,990 --> 00:38:59,680 you know 1164 00:39:04,790 --> 00:39:02,000 a couple people different chapters i 1165 00:39:06,630 --> 00:39:04,800 think that's the way to do it 1166 00:39:08,710 --> 00:39:06,640 yes we mentioned before hasn't it and i 1167 00:39:10,790 --> 00:39:08,720 i did originally i did float the idea 1168 00:39:12,630 --> 00:39:10,800 well if we're going to do it sometime 1169 00:39:14,710 --> 00:39:12,640 then we should have a lot of people 1170 00:39:16,470 --> 00:39:14,720 doing it doing a chapter each um and 1171 00:39:17,910 --> 00:39:16,480 that would work because some of those 1172 00:39:20,230 --> 00:39:17,920 chapters are well you know you've read 1173 00:39:23,589 --> 00:39:20,240 it already many one of those chapters is 1174 00:39:25,270 --> 00:39:23,599 getting over 100 pages isn't it so 1175 00:39:27,030 --> 00:39:25,280 do you think we could get ross uh ross 1176 00:39:28,550 --> 00:39:27,040 culture to read the chapter 1177 00:39:30,390 --> 00:39:28,560 yeah with the voices 1178 00:39:32,230 --> 00:39:30,400 no no no we got to keep it british man 1179 00:39:34,710 --> 00:39:32,240 no offense at all 1180 00:39:36,870 --> 00:39:34,720 because you know should we talk history 1181 00:39:39,990 --> 00:39:36,880 australia's history technically 1182 00:39:42,310 --> 00:39:40,000 technically he's okay 1183 00:39:43,990 --> 00:39:42,320 yes okay yeah i see where you're going 1184 00:39:45,589 --> 00:39:44,000 with that and there are australian 1185 00:39:47,430 --> 00:39:45,599 people in the book there's uh there's an 1186 00:39:49,510 --> 00:39:47,440 australian case so you know the the 1187 00:39:51,510 --> 00:39:49,520 australian guy talks about his cases so 1188 00:39:54,150 --> 00:39:51,520 he'd be great for that he'd be a shoo-in 1189 00:39:57,030 --> 00:39:54,160 all right then okay i'll i'll 1190 00:39:59,430 --> 00:39:57,040 i can see where you're coming from 1191 00:40:01,670 --> 00:39:59,440 that makes sense yeah we can get right 1192 00:40:03,349 --> 00:40:01,680 we can get ryan to do the voiceovers for 1193 00:40:04,710 --> 00:40:03,359 the um for some of the american kind of 1194 00:40:06,150 --> 00:40:04,720 video reports 1195 00:40:07,829 --> 00:40:06,160 you know 1196 00:40:11,990 --> 00:40:07,839 the world's your oyster here can we get 1197 00:40:15,349 --> 00:40:13,510 yeah ooh 1198 00:40:16,309 --> 00:40:15,359 that's a great idea very cool people in 1199 00:40:18,390 --> 00:40:16,319 the comments there's people in the 1200 00:40:20,230 --> 00:40:18,400 comments saying that they do british 1201 00:40:22,470 --> 00:40:20,240 accents i i don't know where ben shapiro 1202 00:40:25,750 --> 00:40:22,480 comes from i guess he's l.a 1203 00:40:29,670 --> 00:40:27,990 [Laughter] 1204 00:40:31,910 --> 00:40:29,680 as long as we get i actually you know 1205 00:40:33,670 --> 00:40:31,920 the hundred the hundred the hundred page 1206 00:40:34,710 --> 00:40:33,680 chapter i think andy mcgrillen needs to 1207 00:40:36,710 --> 00:40:34,720 do that 1208 00:40:38,150 --> 00:40:36,720 yeah well he does a great 1209 00:40:40,550 --> 00:40:38,160 he does a really good english accent 1210 00:40:42,309 --> 00:40:40,560 doesn't he done he's great 1211 00:40:44,230 --> 00:40:42,319 but i love him 1212 00:40:45,910 --> 00:40:44,240 yeah half of them i'm telling you it 1213 00:40:48,870 --> 00:40:45,920 just 1214 00:40:50,950 --> 00:40:48,880 i love andy's accent as it is uh when he 1215 00:40:53,030 --> 00:40:50,960 was on the big phone home and we'll get 1216 00:40:54,390 --> 00:40:53,040 into that in a minute actually um i 1217 00:40:56,470 --> 00:40:54,400 don't mean to take away from your book 1218 00:40:57,349 --> 00:40:56,480 graham absolutely not but uh and you 1219 00:41:00,230 --> 00:40:57,359 know what 1220 00:41:01,750 --> 00:41:00,240 we can go as long as we want tonight um 1221 00:41:03,829 --> 00:41:01,760 but i do want to talk about that and 1222 00:41:05,349 --> 00:41:03,839 andy um i mean 1223 00:41:07,349 --> 00:41:05,359 i thought he was great on the big phone 1224 00:41:09,030 --> 00:41:07,359 we'll get into that in a minute um can i 1225 00:41:10,230 --> 00:41:09,040 just say something and i hate to put you 1226 00:41:11,589 --> 00:41:10,240 on the spot guys i'm just gonna go and 1227 00:41:13,190 --> 00:41:11,599 check on my daughter 1228 00:41:14,470 --> 00:41:13,200 let's talk let's let's bring up the next 1229 00:41:18,950 --> 00:41:14,480 part of the book that we can talk about 1230 00:41:19,670 --> 00:41:18,960 so i can disappear for 30 seconds and um 1231 00:41:22,470 --> 00:41:19,680 so 1232 00:41:24,470 --> 00:41:22,480 let's talk about it from we've seen like 1233 00:41:27,430 --> 00:41:24,480 that the big aspects of the story are 1234 00:41:29,589 --> 00:41:27,440 raf and american 1235 00:41:30,950 --> 00:41:29,599 witnesses and obviously the luftwaffe 1236 00:41:32,630 --> 00:41:30,960 and germans 1237 00:41:35,109 --> 00:41:32,640 can you talk for a couple of minutes 1238 00:41:37,190 --> 00:41:35,119 about maybe french or anybody else or 1239 00:41:39,430 --> 00:41:37,200 even people on the ground that may have 1240 00:41:40,950 --> 00:41:39,440 seen anything and i'll just dip out for 1241 00:41:42,950 --> 00:41:40,960 one second 1242 00:41:45,109 --> 00:41:42,960 okay 1243 00:41:47,190 --> 00:41:45,119 so yeah there are we've gotta control 1244 00:41:48,470 --> 00:41:47,200 the channel quick yeah now we're to talk 1245 00:41:51,030 --> 00:41:48,480 about something else now come on down 1246 00:41:51,910 --> 00:41:51,040 what we're going to talk about 1247 00:41:54,309 --> 00:41:51,920 yeah 1248 00:41:55,990 --> 00:41:54,319 so the case in point there are civilian 1249 00:41:57,750 --> 00:41:56,000 witnesses on the ground in france 1250 00:41:59,910 --> 00:41:57,760 obviously you know it was under 1251 00:42:01,190 --> 00:41:59,920 occupation by the germans so it wasn't 1252 00:42:02,390 --> 00:42:01,200 as if you could if you saw something 1253 00:42:03,990 --> 00:42:02,400 strange in the skies you could go and 1254 00:42:06,470 --> 00:42:04,000 report it to your local police station 1255 00:42:08,230 --> 00:42:06,480 or to the military authorities there was 1256 00:42:10,309 --> 00:42:08,240 no way that people who saw things in 1257 00:42:11,750 --> 00:42:10,319 those days if you were a civilian under 1258 00:42:13,670 --> 00:42:11,760 the german occupation we're going to 1259 00:42:15,510 --> 00:42:13,680 report it to anybody because the last 1260 00:42:17,349 --> 00:42:15,520 thing you do want to do is be like 1261 00:42:19,910 --> 00:42:17,359 you're accused of being a spy 1262 00:42:22,470 --> 00:42:19,920 um so you know these kind of stories 1263 00:42:24,150 --> 00:42:22,480 never came out at the time um so it's 1264 00:42:26,470 --> 00:42:24,160 incredibly difficult to try and get sort 1265 00:42:28,950 --> 00:42:26,480 of you know so other witnesses you're 1266 00:42:30,950 --> 00:42:28,960 going on um 1267 00:42:32,950 --> 00:42:30,960 reports that were sort of given after 1268 00:42:35,030 --> 00:42:32,960 the war and in some cases you know quite 1269 00:42:36,470 --> 00:42:35,040 a long time after the war in in one case 1270 00:42:39,030 --> 00:42:36,480 and there's actually quite a couple of 1271 00:42:41,349 --> 00:42:39,040 major cases in the book um which have 1272 00:42:43,990 --> 00:42:41,359 actually been reported elsewhere uh but 1273 00:42:44,950 --> 00:42:44,000 not in english to a great degree that'd 1274 00:42:47,190 --> 00:42:44,960 be more 1275 00:42:48,390 --> 00:42:47,200 reported in france and the person and 1276 00:42:50,790 --> 00:42:48,400 the witness didn't really come forward 1277 00:42:52,230 --> 00:42:50,800 until the early 1980s uh because he'd 1278 00:42:54,230 --> 00:42:52,240 seen the way that some 1279 00:42:56,390 --> 00:42:54,240 uh ufo witnesses were trapped in the 50s 1280 00:42:58,069 --> 00:42:56,400 and 60s and you didn't like the way you 1281 00:43:00,230 --> 00:42:58,079 know that the the press and the 1282 00:43:01,589 --> 00:43:00,240 newspapers were sort of having a go at 1283 00:43:03,270 --> 00:43:01,599 them for being you know just crazy 1284 00:43:05,910 --> 00:43:03,280 crackpots all the rest of it so he kept 1285 00:43:08,390 --> 00:43:05,920 quiet um and he was only sort of brought 1286 00:43:10,950 --> 00:43:08,400 out the woodwork by a french researcher 1287 00:43:12,950 --> 00:43:10,960 in the 1980s who had basically convinced 1288 00:43:14,950 --> 00:43:12,960 him that it was okay to talk about you 1289 00:43:16,309 --> 00:43:14,960 know what he'd seen during the wall and 1290 00:43:17,670 --> 00:43:16,319 he'd actually had two different 1291 00:43:20,470 --> 00:43:17,680 sightings one in france and one in 1292 00:43:22,950 --> 00:43:20,480 poland when he was a worker a 1293 00:43:25,109 --> 00:43:22,960 slave worker for the germans so you know 1294 00:43:26,550 --> 00:43:25,119 there was there was quite a lot going on 1295 00:43:28,309 --> 00:43:26,560 in terms of the french 1296 00:43:30,870 --> 00:43:28,319 there were sightings in belgium as well 1297 00:43:33,430 --> 00:43:30,880 which i've got listed in the book 1298 00:43:36,390 --> 00:43:33,440 german civilians report of things in 1299 00:43:38,230 --> 00:43:36,400 germany and austrian civilians as well 1300 00:43:40,630 --> 00:43:38,240 so there are reports from those in the 1301 00:43:43,990 --> 00:43:40,640 book there are people in poland who saw 1302 00:43:46,309 --> 00:43:44,000 strange objects people in czechoslovakia 1303 00:43:48,790 --> 00:43:46,319 romania so yes there are civilian 1304 00:43:50,950 --> 00:43:48,800 reports from right across europe um and 1305 00:43:53,670 --> 00:43:50,960 of course there are other reports from 1306 00:43:55,270 --> 00:43:53,680 raf crews over the balkans so these are 1307 00:43:57,430 --> 00:43:55,280 um ones which have never been published 1308 00:44:00,069 --> 00:43:57,440 before um and these are ones are found 1309 00:44:02,230 --> 00:44:00,079 in squadron records and they took place 1310 00:44:04,069 --> 00:44:02,240 in places like bulgaria romania hungary 1311 00:44:07,030 --> 00:44:04,079 czechoslovakia in 1312 00:44:08,230 --> 00:44:07,040 pretty much 1944 and 1945 and not just 1313 00:44:09,829 --> 00:44:08,240 the time when the foo fighters were 1314 00:44:11,670 --> 00:44:09,839 being seen by the americans but these 1315 00:44:13,990 --> 00:44:11,680 cases go back to say sort of the spring 1316 00:44:15,670 --> 00:44:14,000 of 1944 which is much earlier than has 1317 00:44:17,670 --> 00:44:15,680 previously been thought that the you 1318 00:44:20,069 --> 00:44:17,680 know the main body of sightings was seen 1319 00:44:21,829 --> 00:44:20,079 um some russian pilots saw them as well 1320 00:44:23,750 --> 00:44:21,839 those stories are a bit sort of flimsy 1321 00:44:25,349 --> 00:44:23,760 as well because there's not enough 1322 00:44:26,950 --> 00:44:25,359 information that you can go and dig into 1323 00:44:28,950 --> 00:44:26,960 the well you can't dig into russian 1324 00:44:31,030 --> 00:44:28,960 records to start with um you know that's 1325 00:44:32,950 --> 00:44:31,040 practically impossible um unless you've 1326 00:44:34,309 --> 00:44:32,960 got some kind of proper clearance 1327 00:44:36,390 --> 00:44:34,319 there's no way that would give me the 1328 00:44:37,829 --> 00:44:36,400 information if i you know just sort of 1329 00:44:39,510 --> 00:44:37,839 contact somebody in the russian ministry 1330 00:44:40,950 --> 00:44:39,520 of defense and say do you mind if you 1331 00:44:42,069 --> 00:44:40,960 can give me some you know squadron 1332 00:44:43,990 --> 00:44:42,079 records i wouldn't even know what 1333 00:44:45,430 --> 00:44:44,000 squadron to look for because 1334 00:44:47,510 --> 00:44:45,440 that's a great that's the worst thing 1335 00:44:49,430 --> 00:44:47,520 about some of these reports the pilots 1336 00:44:50,870 --> 00:44:49,440 are named but you can't work out which 1337 00:44:52,309 --> 00:44:50,880 you're from you can't even you don't 1338 00:44:54,150 --> 00:44:52,319 even know what type of aircraft they 1339 00:44:55,750 --> 00:44:54,160 were flying so 1340 00:44:57,829 --> 00:44:55,760 it's practically impossible to work out 1341 00:44:59,589 --> 00:44:57,839 what was going on and just track back to 1342 00:45:02,069 --> 00:44:59,599 see were they really where they said 1343 00:45:04,309 --> 00:45:02,079 they were at that time um 1344 00:45:05,589 --> 00:45:04,319 you were going on well faith basically 1345 00:45:08,630 --> 00:45:05,599 but one of the pilots was actually on a 1346 00:45:09,990 --> 00:45:08,640 network first documentary back in 1994 1347 00:45:11,670 --> 00:45:10,000 and it's available on youtube and you 1348 00:45:13,670 --> 00:45:11,680 can see him describe the object you saw 1349 00:45:15,589 --> 00:45:13,680 and he even sketches it out as well and 1350 00:45:17,430 --> 00:45:15,599 there's a link in the book and you can 1351 00:45:20,390 --> 00:45:17,440 actually see it if you've got the kindle 1352 00:45:21,910 --> 00:45:20,400 so uh yeah so there's a lot going on um 1353 00:45:23,910 --> 00:45:21,920 i've probably gone over your 30 seconds 1354 00:45:25,990 --> 00:45:23,920 now sorry i know no no 1355 00:45:27,510 --> 00:45:26,000 you know what i got garnered from that 1356 00:45:29,349 --> 00:45:27,520 as well is that 1357 00:45:30,790 --> 00:45:29,359 a lot of people have well not a lot of 1358 00:45:32,390 --> 00:45:30,800 people i've had a couple of comments 1359 00:45:35,829 --> 00:45:32,400 said to me um 1360 00:45:38,069 --> 00:45:35,839 why why only 1940 to 1945 surely it's 1361 00:45:39,190 --> 00:45:38,079 like a few cases 1362 00:45:40,950 --> 00:45:39,200 viewed by the the british and the 1363 00:45:43,030 --> 00:45:40,960 americans a few by the germans and 1364 00:45:45,670 --> 00:45:43,040 you've just spouted out however many 1365 00:45:47,750 --> 00:45:45,680 other countries that have seen it 1366 00:45:48,870 --> 00:45:47,760 yeah there's your 50 years what i hinted 1367 00:45:50,790 --> 00:45:48,880 that before 1368 00:45:53,109 --> 00:45:50,800 um this american legion article that was 1369 00:45:55,190 --> 00:45:53,119 done by this aid to uh general arnold 1370 00:45:57,670 --> 00:45:55,200 the head of the u.s air force uh army 1371 00:45:59,349 --> 00:45:57,680 air force in world war ii he'd been sent 1372 00:46:01,190 --> 00:45:59,359 on a fact-finding tour around europe to 1373 00:46:02,870 --> 00:46:01,200 check on the logistics and other kind of 1374 00:46:04,550 --> 00:46:02,880 welfare items for the men under his 1375 00:46:06,790 --> 00:46:04,560 command and he'd stayed with people at 1376 00:46:08,790 --> 00:46:06,800 the air bases and he spoke to the the 1377 00:46:10,150 --> 00:46:08,800 the crews from the 415th knight fighter 1378 00:46:13,030 --> 00:46:10,160 squadron who were based in eastern 1379 00:46:14,630 --> 00:46:13,040 france over the winter of 44 45. 1380 00:46:15,750 --> 00:46:14,640 and and he just collected the cases that 1381 00:46:17,829 --> 00:46:15,760 they told him about it's about half a 1382 00:46:20,230 --> 00:46:17,839 dozen he had in this article and he 1383 00:46:22,870 --> 00:46:20,240 mentioned another um a daylight case 1384 00:46:24,470 --> 00:46:22,880 involving a p-47 thunderbolt um squadron 1385 00:46:27,270 --> 00:46:24,480 and he had a couple of cases from from 1386 00:46:29,270 --> 00:46:27,280 the pacific now that was basically all 1387 00:46:31,750 --> 00:46:29,280 the foo fighter cases that were known 1388 00:46:34,349 --> 00:46:31,760 publicly from december 1945 when that 1389 00:46:36,069 --> 00:46:34,359 magazine article was published until the 1390 00:46:39,349 --> 00:46:36,079 mid-1990s 1391 00:46:40,950 --> 00:46:39,359 you unless you were um sort of well 1392 00:46:43,750 --> 00:46:40,960 steeped in ufology and you were getting 1393 00:46:45,750 --> 00:46:43,760 these limited run um magazines that 1394 00:46:48,870 --> 00:46:45,760 occasionally had a story you know once 1395 00:46:51,510 --> 00:46:48,880 every every year or two um or you were 1396 00:46:54,150 --> 00:46:51,520 buying ufo books which might 1397 00:46:56,870 --> 00:46:54,160 might have a book a story maybe once in 1398 00:46:58,630 --> 00:46:56,880 a blue moon you know about um obama crew 1399 00:47:00,069 --> 00:46:58,640 might have seen something and those 1400 00:47:02,550 --> 00:47:00,079 stories were maybe i could count them on 1401 00:47:04,309 --> 00:47:02,560 one hand you know the ones i came across 1402 00:47:06,550 --> 00:47:04,319 looking through the books i had back in 1403 00:47:08,230 --> 00:47:06,560 the 70s and 80s uh and the ones i've 1404 00:47:09,990 --> 00:47:08,240 bought since then 1405 00:47:12,390 --> 00:47:10,000 you know that really narrows that field 1406 00:47:14,710 --> 00:47:12,400 of vision and the accepted wisdom and 1407 00:47:16,950 --> 00:47:14,720 that's what the phrase i use was that 1408 00:47:18,870 --> 00:47:16,960 the foo fighters was a phenomenon that 1409 00:47:20,630 --> 00:47:18,880 started in november 1944 because that's 1410 00:47:22,630 --> 00:47:20,640 what the the the 1411 00:47:25,430 --> 00:47:22,640 original article said this is how they 1412 00:47:27,270 --> 00:47:25,440 began that's that wording he used so 1413 00:47:28,950 --> 00:47:27,280 ufologists through throughout the ages 1414 00:47:30,710 --> 00:47:28,960 just thought oh well that's when they 1415 00:47:32,790 --> 00:47:30,720 started and they ran the end the war so 1416 00:47:35,109 --> 00:47:32,800 what six months seven months 1417 00:47:36,790 --> 00:47:35,119 um and it was a limited phenomenon which 1418 00:47:39,030 --> 00:47:36,800 only affected the u.s 1419 00:47:40,309 --> 00:47:39,040 army air force knight fighter cruise 1420 00:47:42,710 --> 00:47:40,319 which there was only two squadrons 1421 00:47:45,430 --> 00:47:42,720 within in um france and belgium there 1422 00:47:46,710 --> 00:47:45,440 were two other units in in italy um 1423 00:47:48,870 --> 00:47:46,720 doesn't actually mention the italian 1424 00:47:50,470 --> 00:47:48,880 ones though in the article um and that 1425 00:47:53,030 --> 00:47:50,480 was all it was 1426 00:47:55,109 --> 00:47:53,040 you know so a very little kind of niche 1427 00:47:57,589 --> 00:47:55,119 kind of subject with a few crews few 1428 00:47:59,510 --> 00:47:57,599 sightings and nothing much else to go on 1429 00:48:02,150 --> 00:47:59,520 so no wonder it got the kind of short 1430 00:48:03,829 --> 00:48:02,160 shrift that it did from the press from 1431 00:48:05,990 --> 00:48:03,839 ufologists in general 1432 00:48:07,430 --> 00:48:06,000 and that's why i just got skipped over 1433 00:48:09,670 --> 00:48:07,440 but actually there was a hell of a lot 1434 00:48:11,670 --> 00:48:09,680 more going on and hopefully that people 1435 00:48:13,510 --> 00:48:11,680 read the book they'll realize just how 1436 00:48:14,950 --> 00:48:13,520 widespread it was because of the stories 1437 00:48:16,870 --> 00:48:14,960 from the bay of biscay right across 1438 00:48:19,270 --> 00:48:16,880 eastern europe from the north cape of 1439 00:48:20,790 --> 00:48:19,280 norway across to north africa and i've 1440 00:48:22,390 --> 00:48:20,800 got them all in the book so you know 1441 00:48:23,829 --> 00:48:22,400 those some of those have never been put 1442 00:48:26,390 --> 00:48:23,839 in print before 1443 00:48:28,230 --> 00:48:26,400 i i have a feeling that you know when we 1444 00:48:30,470 --> 00:48:28,240 watch these documentaries and they all 1445 00:48:32,150 --> 00:48:30,480 seem to hit on the same cases and they 1446 00:48:33,750 --> 00:48:32,160 kind of leave their original remit 1447 00:48:35,430 --> 00:48:33,760 behind and just all start talking about 1448 00:48:37,510 --> 00:48:35,440 the nimitz and everything like that i 1449 00:48:39,030 --> 00:48:37,520 have a feeling within a few years we'll 1450 00:48:40,630 --> 00:48:39,040 start seeing some of the incredible 1451 00:48:42,390 --> 00:48:40,640 cases from graham's book kind of 1452 00:48:43,829 --> 00:48:42,400 starting to come through because graham 1453 00:48:46,790 --> 00:48:43,839 touched on something really important 1454 00:48:48,390 --> 00:48:46,800 there that you used to have to be really 1455 00:48:50,309 --> 00:48:48,400 into the subject to you know subscribe 1456 00:48:52,790 --> 00:48:50,319 to a magazine or to go out to get books 1457 00:48:54,390 --> 00:48:52,800 or to organize with your library to kind 1458 00:48:56,150 --> 00:48:54,400 of you know ship books from somewhere 1459 00:48:58,790 --> 00:48:56,160 else so on so forth and now we're in the 1460 00:49:01,349 --> 00:48:58,800 age of information where someone can 1461 00:49:04,069 --> 00:49:01,359 chuck in you know foo fighters bracket 1462 00:49:06,230 --> 00:49:04,079 not dave grohl into google and come up 1463 00:49:08,309 --> 00:49:06,240 with graham's book 1464 00:49:10,790 --> 00:49:08,319 and instantly have a bunch of reputable 1465 00:49:12,470 --> 00:49:10,800 information not only 1466 00:49:14,710 --> 00:49:12,480 some great stories to talk about but 1467 00:49:16,390 --> 00:49:14,720 also kind of the struggle of finding 1468 00:49:18,230 --> 00:49:16,400 those stories and the issues with 1469 00:49:20,950 --> 00:49:18,240 digging back into the records of old you 1470 00:49:22,630 --> 00:49:20,960 know we we take our um 1471 00:49:24,390 --> 00:49:22,640 the kind of record keeping we do these 1472 00:49:26,549 --> 00:49:24,400 days for granted i think you know 1473 00:49:28,309 --> 00:49:26,559 pre-90s yeah that stuff didn't exist 1474 00:49:30,470 --> 00:49:28,319 well yeah i mean there was that two-part 1475 00:49:33,030 --> 00:49:30,480 series recently a couple of weeks ago 1476 00:49:34,870 --> 00:49:33,040 the called the foo fighters was it 1477 00:49:36,390 --> 00:49:34,880 which network it was now it was it was 1478 00:49:37,430 --> 00:49:36,400 available here there was it was on the 1479 00:49:40,630 --> 00:49:37,440 series 1480 00:49:42,630 --> 00:49:40,640 yeah i think it's history now 1481 00:49:44,790 --> 00:49:42,640 it was based on foo fighters but what i 1482 00:49:46,710 --> 00:49:44,800 found that they very quickly jumped from 1483 00:49:48,870 --> 00:49:46,720 foo fighters into roswell and then threw 1484 00:49:51,510 --> 00:49:48,880 up into the nimitz cases so it very 1485 00:49:53,990 --> 00:49:51,520 briefly touched upon the foo fighters 1486 00:49:55,990 --> 00:49:54,000 cases now if that had been produced 1487 00:49:57,430 --> 00:49:56,000 after graham's booker to come out that 1488 00:49:59,510 --> 00:49:57,440 would not have been a two-part series 1489 00:50:00,950 --> 00:49:59,520 that would have been a ten-part series 1490 00:50:02,790 --> 00:50:00,960 and it would have stuck with the food 1491 00:50:05,750 --> 00:50:02,800 fighters it wouldn't have had to have 1492 00:50:07,270 --> 00:50:05,760 gone off into post-war roswell and 1493 00:50:09,030 --> 00:50:07,280 kenneth arnold and stuff like that 1494 00:50:11,349 --> 00:50:09,040 because there was enough information in 1495 00:50:12,950 --> 00:50:11,359 graham's book to turn it into such a 1496 00:50:17,670 --> 00:50:12,960 detailed 1497 00:50:20,950 --> 00:50:19,430 slightly disappointed me it wasn't a 1498 00:50:22,390 --> 00:50:20,960 major disappointment because it was just 1499 00:50:23,990 --> 00:50:22,400 nice to see it put out there again with 1500 00:50:25,910 --> 00:50:24,000 some information but it you know and i 1501 00:50:27,990 --> 00:50:25,920 loved seeing anna witty i thought i 1502 00:50:29,670 --> 00:50:28,000 think she's um which doesn't matter of 1503 00:50:31,750 --> 00:50:29,680 interest for me which which cases did 1504 00:50:34,309 --> 00:50:31,760 they cover do you remember any of them 1505 00:50:36,150 --> 00:50:34,319 i i don't even think that any specific 1506 00:50:38,950 --> 00:50:36,160 cases jump out i think it was more the 1507 00:50:42,309 --> 00:50:38,960 broad outline of there were pilots 1508 00:50:44,950 --> 00:50:42,319 across these few years that saw this and 1509 00:50:46,790 --> 00:50:44,960 that and also a few of like 1510 00:50:48,710 --> 00:50:46,800 those photographs that you know in 1511 00:50:51,910 --> 00:50:48,720 private conversation yeah those 1512 00:50:54,309 --> 00:50:51,920 photographs exactly yeah the the kind of 1513 00:50:56,390 --> 00:50:54,319 infamous one of the ah 1514 00:50:58,390 --> 00:50:56,400 there's like a light uh a knob in the 1515 00:50:59,990 --> 00:50:58,400 back between the the one between the two 1516 00:51:01,270 --> 00:51:00,000 aircraft or the one with the wing i 1517 00:51:03,030 --> 00:51:01,280 think it's good 1518 00:51:04,470 --> 00:51:03,040 and the aircraft is a japanese aircraft 1519 00:51:06,069 --> 00:51:04,480 you would tell i mean it's totally wrong 1520 00:51:09,510 --> 00:51:06,079 and it's just not yeah let's see this is 1521 00:51:13,109 --> 00:51:11,349 i've read books where that was that 1522 00:51:15,589 --> 00:51:13,119 picture of the two aircraft with the 1523 00:51:17,670 --> 00:51:15,599 kind of little blob between them um i 1524 00:51:19,109 --> 00:51:17,680 mean that those aircraft type just 1525 00:51:20,950 --> 00:51:19,119 assumed the first time i ever saw that 1526 00:51:23,190 --> 00:51:20,960 picture i went yeah it's japanese it's a 1527 00:51:24,549 --> 00:51:23,200 kai 36 um you know 1528 00:51:26,309 --> 00:51:24,559 it's an army corporation aircraft they 1529 00:51:28,630 --> 00:51:26,319 were using china they wouldn't use any 1530 00:51:30,230 --> 00:51:28,640 you know much else in the pacific and 1531 00:51:31,109 --> 00:51:30,240 they were used for the first couple 1532 00:51:33,030 --> 00:51:31,119 years of the war and then they were too 1533 00:51:34,790 --> 00:51:33,040 obsolete afterwards and you just think 1534 00:51:37,030 --> 00:51:34,800 no and i've seen it even portrayed as a 1535 00:51:38,790 --> 00:51:37,040 luftwaffe aircraft hell i've seen them 1536 00:51:40,790 --> 00:51:38,800 portrayed as american aircraft and you 1537 00:51:42,950 --> 00:51:40,800 just think really you know and you've 1538 00:51:44,950 --> 00:51:42,960 seen that you see that picture pop up on 1539 00:51:47,750 --> 00:51:44,960 websites and people attribute all sorts 1540 00:51:49,750 --> 00:51:47,760 of labels to it i just think come on you 1541 00:51:51,349 --> 00:51:49,760 know just get your facts right for god's 1542 00:51:52,470 --> 00:51:51,359 sake 1543 00:51:57,670 --> 00:51:52,480 you have anybody 1544 00:52:01,109 --> 00:51:59,430 the thing i'll say quickly in defense of 1545 00:52:02,790 --> 00:52:01,119 that two-part series on the foo fight is 1546 00:52:05,030 --> 00:52:02,800 even though it went off into other 1547 00:52:06,630 --> 00:52:05,040 aspects of ufology is that anna whittie 1548 00:52:08,230 --> 00:52:06,640 and i forget the the professor or the 1549 00:52:10,150 --> 00:52:08,240 doctor's name he was the main kind of 1550 00:52:12,069 --> 00:52:10,160 guy in it they didn't make any wild 1551 00:52:14,069 --> 00:52:12,079 claims they were very well spoken 1552 00:52:16,230 --> 00:52:14,079 everything they said was 1553 00:52:18,150 --> 00:52:16,240 within reason it didn't go off into wild 1554 00:52:20,470 --> 00:52:18,160 claims so that was a really good aspect 1555 00:52:22,069 --> 00:52:20,480 of that but i just wish because of the 1556 00:52:23,990 --> 00:52:22,079 timing that it was like a week before 1557 00:52:26,230 --> 00:52:24,000 your book came out like 1558 00:52:27,910 --> 00:52:26,240 i you know it could have been a godzilla 1559 00:52:29,910 --> 00:52:27,920 it was made it must have been made it a 1560 00:52:31,349 --> 00:52:29,920 little while ago in that case it was i 1561 00:52:33,270 --> 00:52:31,359 know yeah 1562 00:52:35,750 --> 00:52:33,280 yeah that's fair enough you give him a 1563 00:52:37,589 --> 00:52:35,760 pass it's a testament to why 1564 00:52:39,349 --> 00:52:37,599 you know i know you said it in a kind of 1565 00:52:41,510 --> 00:52:39,359 light-hearted way i'm kind of looking at 1566 00:52:44,230 --> 00:52:41,520 something and thinking i can do better 1567 00:52:45,510 --> 00:52:44,240 and then going and doing the thing 1568 00:52:47,349 --> 00:52:45,520 you know it can sound a little 1569 00:52:48,790 --> 00:52:47,359 egocentric but at the same time anything 1570 00:52:50,870 --> 00:52:48,800 that's ever been created has come from 1571 00:52:51,829 --> 00:52:50,880 that feeling like i can do that i can do 1572 00:52:53,829 --> 00:52:51,839 better 1573 00:52:55,589 --> 00:52:53,839 do it you know like you never know what 1574 00:52:57,510 --> 00:52:55,599 you're gonna contribute you really don't 1575 00:52:59,589 --> 00:52:57,520 and it can become a thing that's just 1576 00:53:01,270 --> 00:52:59,599 bigger than you 1577 00:53:02,710 --> 00:53:01,280 absolutely i just wonder if it i didn't 1578 00:53:03,990 --> 00:53:02,720 do it you know was anybody going to do 1579 00:53:05,670 --> 00:53:04,000 it so 1580 00:53:07,270 --> 00:53:05,680 you know that's another thing i mean 1581 00:53:09,589 --> 00:53:07,280 that probably does sound really arrogant 1582 00:53:11,270 --> 00:53:09,599 but i i hope you understand what i mean 1583 00:53:12,870 --> 00:53:11,280 there you know was anybody going to 1584 00:53:16,150 --> 00:53:12,880 invest the time and go through the 1585 00:53:18,069 --> 00:53:16,160 records um and and put that together you 1586 00:53:20,390 --> 00:53:18,079 know or would i still be sitting here 1587 00:53:22,150 --> 00:53:20,400 sort of 20 years before you know sort of 1588 00:53:23,910 --> 00:53:22,160 fall off the perch and think i wish 1589 00:53:25,349 --> 00:53:23,920 somebody written that book you know so 1590 00:53:28,069 --> 00:53:25,359 yeah 1591 00:53:29,990 --> 00:53:28,079 you can do it or you can rant 240 1592 00:53:31,190 --> 00:53:30,000 characters at a time about not being 1593 00:53:33,430 --> 00:53:31,200 happy 1594 00:53:34,950 --> 00:53:33,440 yeah one of the two very true 1595 00:53:36,470 --> 00:53:34,960 but listen guys we could talk about the 1596 00:53:37,990 --> 00:53:36,480 book for so much longer but we don't 1597 00:53:39,349 --> 00:53:38,000 want to spoil it for people so what i'm 1598 00:53:40,790 --> 00:53:39,359 going to do 1599 00:53:42,870 --> 00:53:40,800 is 1600 00:53:44,790 --> 00:53:42,880 show everyone that right now on amazon 1601 00:53:46,470 --> 00:53:44,800 you can now get the paperback as well as 1602 00:53:48,309 --> 00:53:46,480 the kindle and i think there's a little 1603 00:53:50,069 --> 00:53:48,319 sale on on amazon as well they've not 1604 00:53:52,790 --> 00:53:50,079 like yeah they've knocked the price down 1605 00:53:54,549 --> 00:53:52,800 without telling me yeah so you know 1606 00:53:57,349 --> 00:53:54,559 hopefully graham still gets the same cut 1607 00:53:58,950 --> 00:53:57,359 as before like amazon 1608 00:54:00,309 --> 00:53:58,960 i'm pretty sure actually i think that's 1609 00:54:02,630 --> 00:54:00,319 how it works yeah 1610 00:54:05,030 --> 00:54:02,640 yeah but you can you can get it on 1611 00:54:06,549 --> 00:54:05,040 kindle if you've got kindle unlimited i 1612 00:54:08,630 --> 00:54:06,559 think it's available on there so you pay 1613 00:54:11,030 --> 00:54:08,640 your monthly whatever a few pounds or 1614 00:54:14,309 --> 00:54:11,040 dollars and it's available on kindle 1615 00:54:16,309 --> 00:54:14,319 unlimited so please please 1616 00:54:18,150 --> 00:54:16,319 i cannot implore you enough to please go 1617 00:54:19,190 --> 00:54:18,160 and check out the book 1618 00:54:20,230 --> 00:54:19,200 but um 1619 00:54:22,549 --> 00:54:20,240 so 1620 00:54:24,549 --> 00:54:22,559 no no my pleasure my friend like i said 1621 00:54:26,309 --> 00:54:24,559 i could talk about it for hours but then 1622 00:54:27,829 --> 00:54:26,319 we'd kind of spoil it to a degree so 1623 00:54:29,349 --> 00:54:27,839 like i have to cut it off somewhere even 1624 00:54:31,270 --> 00:54:29,359 though i don't want to 1625 00:54:33,190 --> 00:54:31,280 go on dan you're about to 1626 00:54:35,430 --> 00:54:33,200 just gonna say if if it's a good time to 1627 00:54:37,030 --> 00:54:35,440 kind of say that um you know the art on 1628 00:54:38,630 --> 00:54:37,040 the front of the book olaf and i have 1629 00:54:40,789 --> 00:54:38,640 put up on a 1630 00:54:42,309 --> 00:54:40,799 red bubble and 1631 00:54:44,710 --> 00:54:42,319 i'm going to catch myself like ooloff 1632 00:54:46,950 --> 00:54:44,720 not olaf i always like the disney 1633 00:54:48,950 --> 00:54:46,960 character 1634 00:54:50,789 --> 00:54:48,960 um but you can see it on the wall behind 1635 00:54:52,549 --> 00:54:50,799 me up there and you can buy prints of it 1636 00:54:54,710 --> 00:54:52,559 and basically all of the profits from 1637 00:54:55,990 --> 00:54:54,720 that are going to go towards the galileo 1638 00:54:57,349 --> 00:54:56,000 project so you're not just getting a 1639 00:55:00,470 --> 00:54:57,359 cool thing for your wall you're also 1640 00:55:04,069 --> 00:55:00,480 going to be helping ufo research 1641 00:55:06,309 --> 00:55:04,079 absolutely and i will just 1642 00:55:10,069 --> 00:55:06,319 for the people that may not have seen it 1643 00:55:12,069 --> 00:55:10,079 because i want to emphasize 1644 00:55:14,069 --> 00:55:12,079 the detail on this 1645 00:55:15,510 --> 00:55:14,079 picture because it is 1646 00:55:17,190 --> 00:55:15,520 correct i mean if you look right in 1647 00:55:19,670 --> 00:55:17,200 there even behind the spinning 1648 00:55:21,030 --> 00:55:19,680 propellers you can see the raf logos and 1649 00:55:22,549 --> 00:55:21,040 stuff and 1650 00:55:24,870 --> 00:55:22,559 the details 1651 00:55:26,630 --> 00:55:24,880 and the code letters on the aircraft 1652 00:55:29,349 --> 00:55:26,640 as well are accurate to the aircraft 1653 00:55:32,230 --> 00:55:29,359 involved it is they are and the stars 1654 00:55:33,670 --> 00:55:32,240 are accurate the the time and place too 1655 00:55:35,510 --> 00:55:33,680 um 1656 00:55:37,430 --> 00:55:35,520 so you could you could totally trace it 1657 00:55:38,950 --> 00:55:37,440 with that uh with that picture there are 1658 00:55:41,030 --> 00:55:38,960 a whole bunch of easter eggs in there as 1659 00:55:42,630 --> 00:55:41,040 well you know the city beneath uh 1660 00:55:45,430 --> 00:55:42,640 there's a special reason for that being 1661 00:55:47,349 --> 00:55:45,440 there um and and like i say it all came 1662 00:55:49,270 --> 00:55:47,359 together really really um 1663 00:55:50,549 --> 00:55:49,280 really organically yeah and it all 1664 00:55:52,390 --> 00:55:50,559 relates to one of the 1665 00:55:55,270 --> 00:55:52,400 the major stories in the book as well so 1666 00:56:00,069 --> 00:55:56,870 the first story 1667 00:56:02,230 --> 00:56:00,079 so yeah 1668 00:56:04,549 --> 00:56:02,240 i i always feel with that image like you 1669 00:56:06,950 --> 00:56:04,559 can kind of 1670 00:56:09,109 --> 00:56:06,960 you can almost hear it you know 1671 00:56:10,950 --> 00:56:09,119 yeah absolutely the shouts and the the 1672 00:56:13,270 --> 00:56:10,960 guns kind of opening up uh one of the 1673 00:56:16,390 --> 00:56:13,280 really really cool touches uh the graham 1674 00:56:19,109 --> 00:56:16,400 added for us was uh basically when you 1675 00:56:20,630 --> 00:56:19,119 look at trace arounds they're not uh the 1676 00:56:22,470 --> 00:56:20,640 whole magazine doesn't have trace 1677 00:56:24,630 --> 00:56:22,480 arounds in it it's only every like 10 or 1678 00:56:26,150 --> 00:56:24,640 12 or so they're putting randomly so you 1679 00:56:27,910 --> 00:56:26,160 can see actually you know in the colors 1680 00:56:29,270 --> 00:56:27,920 of the bullets there it's only every few 1681 00:56:32,069 --> 00:56:29,280 that are kind of hitting that tracer 1682 00:56:33,990 --> 00:56:32,079 color which is is you know it's neat 1683 00:56:35,829 --> 00:56:34,000 and i can tell you everyone right now 1684 00:56:37,349 --> 00:56:35,839 that 1685 00:56:38,789 --> 00:56:37,359 i don't have the book i want the book 1686 00:56:39,990 --> 00:56:38,799 and it's coming it's in the post and i 1687 00:56:42,829 --> 00:56:40,000 want to get my hands on it but i've got 1688 00:56:45,670 --> 00:56:42,839 the t-shirt and the image looks 1689 00:56:48,789 --> 00:56:45,680 incredible on a t-shirt as well 1690 00:56:50,950 --> 00:56:48,799 i i can promise you that so yeah um i 1691 00:56:52,309 --> 00:56:50,960 think i think i've put the red bubble 1692 00:56:54,069 --> 00:56:52,319 and everything in the link below i can't 1693 00:56:55,349 --> 00:56:54,079 remember but i will if i haven't i've 1694 00:56:57,349 --> 00:56:55,359 definitely put the link to the book in 1695 00:56:58,710 --> 00:56:57,359 there because that's the one of course 1696 00:57:01,349 --> 00:56:58,720 on the off chance that you didn't you 1697 00:57:03,109 --> 00:57:01,359 can just go to thesignal.com um and just 1698 00:57:05,430 --> 00:57:03,119 click uh teas and prints and it'll take 1699 00:57:07,109 --> 00:57:05,440 you through to the redbubble store yeah 1700 00:57:09,109 --> 00:57:07,119 it's incredible man 1701 00:57:10,549 --> 00:57:09,119 so yeah thank you so much guys we're 1702 00:57:12,549 --> 00:57:10,559 gonna move on because that sounded a bit 1703 00:57:14,789 --> 00:57:12,559 like we're to finish sorry about that um 1704 00:57:16,069 --> 00:57:14,799 let's talk about the big phone home man 1705 00:57:17,430 --> 00:57:16,079 like 1706 00:57:20,150 --> 00:57:17,440 where do we start 1707 00:57:21,990 --> 00:57:20,160 i guess day one but 1708 00:57:24,309 --> 00:57:22,000 what was 1709 00:57:26,069 --> 00:57:24,319 for each of you who was your your 1710 00:57:27,510 --> 00:57:26,079 favorite panelist that came on and none 1711 00:57:29,349 --> 00:57:27,520 of you are allowed to see me because 1712 00:57:32,549 --> 00:57:29,359 that's just it's not fair 1713 00:57:37,349 --> 00:57:34,789 i'll i'll i'll start then um i had a 1714 00:57:40,390 --> 00:57:37,359 really good time listening to chris leto 1715 00:57:42,789 --> 00:57:40,400 dj san marco and manny congratulatory 1716 00:57:43,750 --> 00:57:42,799 surname um yesterday um yesterday 1717 00:57:46,150 --> 00:57:43,760 afternoon 1718 00:57:48,710 --> 00:57:46,160 uh i was listening to it and i just felt 1719 00:57:50,150 --> 00:57:48,720 that that was a great was it an hour and 1720 00:57:52,390 --> 00:57:50,160 a half or something they were on and 1721 00:57:54,870 --> 00:57:52,400 they were just talking incredibly about 1722 00:57:57,349 --> 00:57:54,880 the kind of reporting procedure or you 1723 00:57:58,870 --> 00:57:57,359 know for the us air force about let's 1724 00:58:00,150 --> 00:57:58,880 say if they came across something and 1725 00:58:01,349 --> 00:58:00,160 you were like you know squadron pilot 1726 00:58:03,430 --> 00:58:01,359 and you hadn't reported this kind of 1727 00:58:05,190 --> 00:58:03,440 thing before you got to a point where 1728 00:58:07,190 --> 00:58:05,200 you had to then be read into things and 1729 00:58:08,549 --> 00:58:07,200 you'd be what would chris uh let him say 1730 00:58:09,990 --> 00:58:08,559 given an envelope 1731 00:58:12,069 --> 00:58:10,000 and you had to open it and that read 1732 00:58:14,230 --> 00:58:12,079 like along the lines of right you now 1733 00:58:15,990 --> 00:58:14,240 know about we are investigating it you 1734 00:58:17,430 --> 00:58:16,000 now cannot tell anybody of this kind of 1735 00:58:19,510 --> 00:58:17,440 thing you know it was this kind of 1736 00:58:20,950 --> 00:58:19,520 detail and you know he wasn't just 1737 00:58:24,069 --> 00:58:20,960 talking about this kind of thing a dj 1738 00:58:26,309 --> 00:58:24,079 because he used to be a um an mc130 1739 00:58:29,030 --> 00:58:26,319 hercules pilot i believe yeah uh on 1740 00:58:30,309 --> 00:58:29,040 combat talons so he has a incredible 1741 00:58:33,109 --> 00:58:30,319 wealth of kind of knowledge and 1742 00:58:34,549 --> 00:58:33,119 expertise in your kind of low level and 1743 00:58:37,190 --> 00:58:34,559 you know kind of special operations 1744 00:58:39,349 --> 00:58:37,200 flying so you know that's a particular 1745 00:58:41,109 --> 00:58:39,359 skill set um so you know they're getting 1746 00:58:43,109 --> 00:58:41,119 some kind of sneaky beaky kind of flying 1747 00:58:44,710 --> 00:58:43,119 that you know kind of thing they do so 1748 00:58:47,030 --> 00:58:44,720 there's a lot of expertise between the 1749 00:58:48,470 --> 00:58:47,040 two of them i caught i came in a little 1750 00:58:50,150 --> 00:58:48,480 bit late about the first few minutes of 1751 00:58:51,349 --> 00:58:50,160 the conversation so i can't quite 1752 00:58:53,349 --> 00:58:51,359 remember what manny's kind of 1753 00:58:54,789 --> 00:58:53,359 qualifications were what his history was 1754 00:58:56,150 --> 00:58:54,799 but in terms of just the three of them 1755 00:58:57,670 --> 00:58:56,160 and how they were talking and how 1756 00:58:59,750 --> 00:58:57,680 everybody else was talking to them that 1757 00:59:01,430 --> 00:58:59,760 was a thrilling hour for me just to see 1758 00:59:03,910 --> 00:59:01,440 the kind of perspective from you know 1759 00:59:06,470 --> 00:59:03,920 kind of people who had served and fairly 1760 00:59:08,309 --> 00:59:06,480 recently had served um and chris leto 1761 00:59:10,390 --> 00:59:08,319 said he'd never seen anything you know 1762 00:59:11,589 --> 00:59:10,400 um odd but he was still interested 1763 00:59:13,109 --> 00:59:11,599 enough to contribute and he was 1764 00:59:15,270 --> 00:59:13,119 contributing in a meaningful way and it 1765 00:59:16,710 --> 00:59:15,280 was it was really i just felt that for 1766 00:59:18,710 --> 00:59:16,720 me that was a really good kind of 1767 00:59:20,150 --> 00:59:18,720 conversation over an hour and whatever 1768 00:59:22,549 --> 00:59:20,160 period it was 1769 00:59:24,309 --> 00:59:22,559 absolutely i agree with that so much i 1770 00:59:26,069 --> 00:59:24,319 had the pleasure of joining chris on his 1771 00:59:28,470 --> 00:59:26,079 channel a couple of weeks ago and he 1772 00:59:30,870 --> 00:59:28,480 really is such a nice guy whether you 1773 00:59:33,510 --> 00:59:30,880 know uap aside and things like that and 1774 00:59:35,510 --> 00:59:33,520 he's connected to this subject not as an 1775 00:59:37,430 --> 00:59:35,520 experiencer or anything like that but 1776 00:59:39,190 --> 00:59:37,440 just as someone who's super interested 1777 00:59:41,589 --> 00:59:39,200 in it and i can relate to that as a 1778 00:59:43,589 --> 00:59:41,599 non-experiencer as well and he's 1779 00:59:44,789 --> 00:59:43,599 actually coming on to to this channel on 1780 00:59:47,349 --> 00:59:44,799 saturday 1781 00:59:48,870 --> 00:59:47,359 uh coming up like next week so 1782 00:59:50,710 --> 00:59:48,880 yeah that'd be great maybe you could 1783 00:59:53,349 --> 00:59:50,720 join us graham 1784 00:59:55,510 --> 00:59:53,359 i'd love to yeah there you go um which 1785 00:59:59,109 --> 00:59:55,520 which saturdays are sorry this this 1786 01:00:00,950 --> 00:59:59,119 saturday yeah what time uh 8 pm uk i 1787 01:00:03,030 --> 01:00:00,960 think i might be back home i'm actually 1788 01:00:05,190 --> 01:00:03,040 down in york for the day so i may not be 1789 01:00:06,870 --> 01:00:05,200 back in time but i'll i'll jump into the 1790 01:00:08,630 --> 01:00:06,880 chat at the end how about that or you 1791 01:00:10,390 --> 01:00:08,640 can jump in at the end we will talk 1792 01:00:11,589 --> 01:00:10,400 about that behind the scenes okay no 1793 01:00:14,549 --> 01:00:11,599 worries thank you it'd be great to have 1794 01:00:16,710 --> 01:00:14,559 you there um as far as what i enjoyed 1795 01:00:18,470 --> 01:00:16,720 about the weekend if i had to pull out a 1796 01:00:22,069 --> 01:00:18,480 specific it would be 1797 01:00:25,670 --> 01:00:22,079 i've got two it would be 1798 01:00:26,870 --> 01:00:25,680 the second day scientists um i can't 1799 01:00:28,710 --> 01:00:26,880 remember all their names but i know it's 1800 01:00:30,150 --> 01:00:28,720 the same panel with alien scientist and 1801 01:00:31,270 --> 01:00:30,160 the guy with his workshop that was 1802 01:00:32,950 --> 01:00:31,280 talking about 1803 01:00:34,710 --> 01:00:32,960 yeah we're doing kind of anti-gravity 1804 01:00:37,270 --> 01:00:34,720 stuff back here and stuff like that that 1805 01:00:39,750 --> 01:00:37,280 was so far above my head that it was 1806 01:00:42,789 --> 01:00:39,760 pretty much at 30 000 feet above my head 1807 01:00:44,630 --> 01:00:42,799 you know it sounded amazing and i 1808 01:00:45,750 --> 01:00:44,640 believe that it was legit because they 1809 01:00:47,670 --> 01:00:45,760 could have said anything and i'd 1810 01:00:48,950 --> 01:00:47,680 probably believed it but i found that 1811 01:00:50,470 --> 01:00:48,960 really intriguing because i've never 1812 01:00:52,789 --> 01:00:50,480 seen that really before related to the 1813 01:00:54,309 --> 01:00:52,799 uap subject you know i do check out the 1814 01:00:55,670 --> 01:00:54,319 singularity lab here and there but i 1815 01:00:57,589 --> 01:00:55,680 felt like that really went above and 1816 01:00:59,829 --> 01:00:57,599 beyond when it came to the the physics 1817 01:01:02,309 --> 01:00:59,839 and a bit of theoretical physics as well 1818 01:01:04,150 --> 01:01:02,319 that really showed that it they are 1819 01:01:06,870 --> 01:01:04,160 involved in this subject and willing to 1820 01:01:08,390 --> 01:01:06,880 talk to people like us and the general 1821 01:01:10,470 --> 01:01:08,400 ufology and 1822 01:01:12,870 --> 01:01:10,480 uap researchers 1823 01:01:14,710 --> 01:01:12,880 and then i have to shout out and i know 1824 01:01:17,109 --> 01:01:14,720 people will probably say are boring but 1825 01:01:19,270 --> 01:01:17,119 the conversation with lou elizondo ross 1826 01:01:22,630 --> 01:01:19,280 coulter and robert salas 1827 01:01:25,990 --> 01:01:22,640 did stand out for me because 1828 01:01:27,990 --> 01:01:26,000 more so because of ross coulthard he he 1829 01:01:29,589 --> 01:01:28,000 he alluded to some stuff that i'm really 1830 01:01:32,069 --> 01:01:29,599 interested in the moment with 1831 01:01:34,069 --> 01:01:32,079 bob fish and 1832 01:01:35,670 --> 01:01:34,079 tracking frequencies and stuff and that 1833 01:01:37,670 --> 01:01:35,680 was a conversation that was going on all 1834 01:01:38,710 --> 01:01:37,680 weekend especially in the chat i know 1835 01:01:41,829 --> 01:01:38,720 dan 1836 01:01:43,829 --> 01:01:41,839 you can uh relate to that because i saw 1837 01:01:45,829 --> 01:01:43,839 a lot of comments in the chat going back 1838 01:01:47,510 --> 01:01:45,839 and forth about these 1839 01:01:49,829 --> 01:01:47,520 signatures and 1840 01:01:50,710 --> 01:01:49,839 this piece of equipment this 1841 01:01:52,789 --> 01:01:50,720 one 1842 01:01:54,549 --> 01:01:52,799 simple piece of equipment that we 1843 01:01:56,870 --> 01:01:54,559 probably all should know about that's 1844 01:01:58,549 --> 01:01:56,880 quite basic and not as technical as you 1845 01:02:00,150 --> 01:01:58,559 might think 1846 01:02:01,670 --> 01:02:00,160 and that's really got me thinking and 1847 01:02:04,309 --> 01:02:01,680 i've actually reached out to a lot of 1848 01:02:05,750 --> 01:02:04,319 people the last couple of days who 1849 01:02:08,069 --> 01:02:05,760 might allude to that because i'm so 1850 01:02:09,589 --> 01:02:08,079 desperate to know you know so what do 1851 01:02:11,109 --> 01:02:09,599 you think of that dan did that really 1852 01:02:13,029 --> 01:02:11,119 capture you as well 1853 01:02:15,589 --> 01:02:13,039 it did um the signature stuff is an 1854 01:02:17,190 --> 01:02:15,599 interesting one um 1855 01:02:19,910 --> 01:02:17,200 on the off chance people know james 1856 01:02:22,390 --> 01:02:19,920 mcdonald he uh 1857 01:02:25,029 --> 01:02:22,400 he he spoke about radio signal that he 1858 01:02:28,309 --> 01:02:25,039 thought was ufos and then you know long 1859 01:02:32,950 --> 01:02:30,150 dead in the desert there's no easy way 1860 01:02:34,950 --> 01:02:32,960 to say that um but 1861 01:02:36,789 --> 01:02:34,960 he suggested the ufos emitted a radio 1862 01:02:38,069 --> 01:02:36,799 signal that was oscillating and if 1863 01:02:40,789 --> 01:02:38,079 anyone's got the right equipment go for 1864 01:02:43,910 --> 01:02:40,799 it and see what happens uh between 295 1865 01:02:46,470 --> 01:02:43,920 to 300 megahertz uh in a beat frequency 1866 01:02:49,430 --> 01:02:46,480 of 600 hertz so if anyone knows what 1867 01:02:51,430 --> 01:02:49,440 that means let us know please 1868 01:02:52,549 --> 01:02:51,440 and and we'll kind of have a look at you 1869 01:02:55,510 --> 01:02:52,559 know 1870 01:02:57,270 --> 01:02:55,520 maybe what it leads to um 1871 01:03:00,829 --> 01:02:57,280 in terms of the censor i can't say 1872 01:03:04,069 --> 01:03:00,839 anything about that anymore so sorry 1873 01:03:05,589 --> 01:03:04,079 um i understand i understand one one of 1874 01:03:09,349 --> 01:03:05,599 the 1875 01:03:11,349 --> 01:03:09,359 right robert salison is you know what is 1876 01:03:13,750 --> 01:03:11,359 this the louis alexander show is 1877 01:03:15,430 --> 01:03:13,760 hilarious um but me thinks that it's 1878 01:03:16,630 --> 01:03:15,440 just you know an elderly person messing 1879 01:03:19,589 --> 01:03:16,640 with people because they like to drop 1880 01:03:21,109 --> 01:03:19,599 bombs and giggle you know um 1881 01:03:22,710 --> 01:03:21,119 but 1882 01:03:24,870 --> 01:03:22,720 yeah that panel was really interesting 1883 01:03:27,190 --> 01:03:24,880 ross had a few super interesting 1884 01:03:28,470 --> 01:03:27,200 questions um 1885 01:03:30,309 --> 01:03:28,480 everything that lou says always 1886 01:03:31,910 --> 01:03:30,319 captivates me but the standout of the 1887 01:03:35,109 --> 01:03:31,920 weekend for me would have to be erling 1888 01:03:37,349 --> 01:03:35,119 strand uh from hastelland just because i 1889 01:03:38,309 --> 01:03:37,359 wasn't expecting it um 1890 01:03:39,750 --> 01:03:38,319 and 1891 01:03:41,589 --> 01:03:39,760 we we've had a few people talking about 1892 01:03:43,589 --> 01:03:41,599 has to learn who weren't involved in the 1893 01:03:45,990 --> 01:03:43,599 work i'm but are familiar with it and it 1894 01:03:48,309 --> 01:03:46,000 was really great to see earling on there 1895 01:03:51,430 --> 01:03:48,319 kind of getting his jews as someone who 1896 01:03:52,630 --> 01:03:51,440 studied the earth light or uap phenomena 1897 01:03:54,870 --> 01:03:52,640 um 1898 01:03:56,390 --> 01:03:54,880 and and you know sharing that i it's a 1899 01:03:58,309 --> 01:03:56,400 really really interesting 1900 01:04:00,549 --> 01:03:58,319 uh bit of research that was done really 1901 01:04:02,069 --> 01:04:00,559 before we kind of had 1902 01:04:04,069 --> 01:04:02,079 the internet and everything like that 1903 01:04:06,549 --> 01:04:04,079 and you know they had really low i 1904 01:04:07,829 --> 01:04:06,559 remember they they would stream um and i 1905 01:04:10,630 --> 01:04:07,839 think you still can only certain 1906 01:04:12,789 --> 01:04:10,640 websites sorry webcams work you can kind 1907 01:04:14,230 --> 01:04:12,799 of watch the areas and i used to do it 1908 01:04:15,349 --> 01:04:14,240 way back in the day and just sit there 1909 01:04:16,630 --> 01:04:15,359 and watch them for hours i'd have the 1910 01:04:18,230 --> 01:04:16,640 window open on the side while i was 1911 01:04:20,150 --> 01:04:18,240 watching a movie or something and i 1912 01:04:21,910 --> 01:04:20,160 never saw anything but you know it was a 1913 01:04:23,990 --> 01:04:21,920 big part of my life so seeing erling 1914 01:04:25,190 --> 01:04:24,000 kind of there was a was a super cool 1915 01:04:26,549 --> 01:04:25,200 moment for me 1916 01:04:29,109 --> 01:04:26,559 absolutely and everything you started 1917 01:04:31,270 --> 01:04:29,119 that back in was it 93 1918 01:04:32,470 --> 01:04:31,280 yeah yeah 1919 01:04:34,230 --> 01:04:32,480 project 1920 01:04:37,029 --> 01:04:34,240 yeah yeah and we're talking you know 1921 01:04:38,870 --> 01:04:37,039 they did their studies 84 85 um the 1922 01:04:40,710 --> 01:04:38,880 activity dropped off 1923 01:04:42,069 --> 01:04:40,720 um 1924 01:04:42,789 --> 01:04:42,079 it's hard to know what to make of it 1925 01:04:45,029 --> 01:04:42,799 right 1926 01:04:46,069 --> 01:04:45,039 it is because if you look i mean i've 1927 01:04:48,150 --> 01:04:46,079 looked into it a little bit over the 1928 01:04:50,230 --> 01:04:48,160 last couple of days because 1929 01:04:51,589 --> 01:04:50,240 i've seen it crop up not only on the big 1930 01:04:53,270 --> 01:04:51,599 phone home but on twitter and things 1931 01:04:54,789 --> 01:04:53,280 like that and well we can say 1932 01:04:56,230 --> 01:04:54,799 campbell where 1933 01:04:58,789 --> 01:04:56,240 i hope i'm getting that's her name right 1934 01:05:01,349 --> 01:04:58,799 he he posted out the idea that 1935 01:05:02,150 --> 01:05:01,359 hesterland was the same thing as the tic 1936 01:05:03,670 --> 01:05:02,160 tac 1937 01:05:05,670 --> 01:05:03,680 um 1938 01:05:07,430 --> 01:05:05,680 in a very authoritative manner and that 1939 01:05:08,390 --> 01:05:07,440 that kind of you know created a lot of 1940 01:05:09,510 --> 01:05:08,400 discussion 1941 01:05:11,270 --> 01:05:09,520 it did but it's good because it's 1942 01:05:13,430 --> 01:05:11,280 brought the discussion forward even if i 1943 01:05:14,470 --> 01:05:13,440 respectfully disagree 1944 01:05:15,910 --> 01:05:14,480 with 1945 01:05:17,990 --> 01:05:15,920 a fair amount of the points in the 1946 01:05:19,910 --> 01:05:18,000 article but it did bring it to my 1947 01:05:22,150 --> 01:05:19,920 attention it made me look into it so i 1948 01:05:23,990 --> 01:05:22,160 can say that that's a positive from from 1949 01:05:25,990 --> 01:05:24,000 what he's done and i have a lot of 1950 01:05:27,750 --> 01:05:26,000 respect for the guy you know so so no 1951 01:05:29,670 --> 01:05:27,760 harm done but i think what's also 1952 01:05:32,710 --> 01:05:29,680 interesting with the hesterlin lights is 1953 01:05:34,150 --> 01:05:32,720 that it isn't just a case of orbs 1954 01:05:36,309 --> 01:05:34,160 there have been 1955 01:05:38,470 --> 01:05:36,319 physical craft or what people say 1956 01:05:41,750 --> 01:05:38,480 they've seen physical craft of various 1957 01:05:43,430 --> 01:05:41,760 shapes and sizes not just strange lights 1958 01:05:45,270 --> 01:05:43,440 but then when they do see strange lights 1959 01:05:48,829 --> 01:05:45,280 they've been tracked to incredible 1960 01:05:51,589 --> 01:05:48,839 speeds the kind of speeds that you can 1961 01:05:52,950 --> 01:05:51,599 relate to what we've been told the 1962 01:05:54,150 --> 01:05:52,960 tic-tac 1963 01:05:56,390 --> 01:05:54,160 um has 1964 01:05:58,150 --> 01:05:56,400 traveled back in 2004. so i see the 1965 01:05:59,990 --> 01:05:58,160 correlation or the connection 1966 01:06:02,549 --> 01:06:00,000 i think it's just we need to be careful 1967 01:06:05,510 --> 01:06:02,559 about going from here to all the way 1968 01:06:07,109 --> 01:06:05,520 over there instantly for sure 1969 01:06:08,630 --> 01:06:07,119 this is the thing is kind of making 1970 01:06:09,829 --> 01:06:08,640 answers where there aren't any it's cool 1971 01:06:12,630 --> 01:06:09,839 to speculate and kind of have 1972 01:06:13,910 --> 01:06:12,640 conversations um but like i'm i'm fond 1973 01:06:16,230 --> 01:06:13,920 of hastellon just because i think 1974 01:06:17,990 --> 01:06:16,240 there's a lot of overlap and though 1975 01:06:19,910 --> 01:06:18,000 though not all earth lights are uap and 1976 01:06:21,029 --> 01:06:19,920 all you ap or earth lights 1977 01:06:22,630 --> 01:06:21,039 you you know there are a few 1978 01:06:24,309 --> 01:06:22,640 possibilities either it's nothing to do 1979 01:06:25,670 --> 01:06:24,319 with it at all 1980 01:06:27,349 --> 01:06:25,680 or 1981 01:06:29,430 --> 01:06:27,359 they're kind of you know the same 1982 01:06:30,230 --> 01:06:29,440 phenomena whatever they are 1983 01:06:32,390 --> 01:06:30,240 or 1984 01:06:34,470 --> 01:06:32,400 they're not the same phenomena but 1985 01:06:36,150 --> 01:06:34,480 the amount of energy produced by these 1986 01:06:38,069 --> 01:06:36,160 lights and the way that they do it is a 1987 01:06:40,549 --> 01:06:38,079 mechanism by which we could achieve the 1988 01:06:43,109 --> 01:06:40,559 technology that you would uab are using 1989 01:06:44,870 --> 01:06:43,119 so it's an incredible ufo lab and it's 1990 01:06:46,789 --> 01:06:44,880 not the only 1991 01:06:48,150 --> 01:06:46,799 you know place on earth that these 1992 01:06:49,990 --> 01:06:48,160 things occur there there are a lot of 1993 01:06:51,589 --> 01:06:50,000 them long than they are lights in the uk 1994 01:06:53,029 --> 01:06:51,599 uh the brown mountain lights the minmin 1995 01:06:55,829 --> 01:06:53,039 lights in australia you know they're 1996 01:06:57,510 --> 01:06:55,839 everywhere and you people listening 1997 01:06:58,630 --> 01:06:57,520 probably have a feeling like hold on a 1998 01:07:01,029 --> 01:06:58,640 second this just sounds like they were 1999 01:07:02,390 --> 01:07:01,039 studying uap without saying it yeah 2000 01:07:03,990 --> 01:07:02,400 that's exactly what they were doing they 2001 01:07:05,910 --> 01:07:04,000 couldn't say the word so they kind of 2002 01:07:08,309 --> 01:07:05,920 didn't for a long time though did they 2003 01:07:09,990 --> 01:07:08,319 it took them so long because they came 2004 01:07:12,230 --> 01:07:10,000 at it from that scientific angle they 2005 01:07:14,150 --> 01:07:12,240 didn't want to get that ridicule and it 2006 01:07:15,750 --> 01:07:14,160 took them quite a long time to really 2007 01:07:17,349 --> 01:07:15,760 get to that point and i yeah that's 2008 01:07:18,150 --> 01:07:17,359 totally understandable what about you 2009 01:07:20,470 --> 01:07:18,160 graham what do you think of the 2010 01:07:22,630 --> 01:07:20,480 hairstyling well funny enough michael 2011 01:07:23,589 --> 01:07:22,640 mataloni um he asked me on friday night 2012 01:07:25,029 --> 01:07:23,599 when we were talking about the foo 2013 01:07:26,630 --> 01:07:25,039 fighters on uh 2014 01:07:28,230 --> 01:07:26,640 an identified celebrity review he said 2015 01:07:29,510 --> 01:07:28,240 you know what i think about the haskell 2016 01:07:30,710 --> 01:07:29,520 and lights did i think that they might 2017 01:07:31,750 --> 01:07:30,720 have been responsible for the foo 2018 01:07:32,870 --> 01:07:31,760 fighters 2019 01:07:34,069 --> 01:07:32,880 um 2020 01:07:35,750 --> 01:07:34,079 and i do actually address this in the 2021 01:07:37,589 --> 01:07:35,760 book just very briefly and i say well 2022 01:07:39,910 --> 01:07:37,599 you know earth lights i can't rule it 2023 01:07:42,789 --> 01:07:39,920 out as a possibility because one i don't 2024 01:07:45,109 --> 01:07:42,799 know enough about the subject and and i 2025 01:07:47,270 --> 01:07:45,119 can't then say well it wasn't those you 2026 01:07:49,430 --> 01:07:47,280 know categorically and they could have 2027 01:07:51,589 --> 01:07:49,440 been responsible for something like that 2028 01:07:54,950 --> 01:07:51,599 a phenomenon along those lines could 2029 01:07:56,789 --> 01:07:54,960 have been responsible for some of the of 2030 01:07:58,789 --> 01:07:56,799 the kind of stories that are in the book 2031 01:08:00,630 --> 01:07:58,799 but there are other ones where you just 2032 01:08:02,630 --> 01:08:00,640 again it's 2033 01:08:04,870 --> 01:08:02,640 i i sort of fallen thinking i don't 2034 01:08:06,789 --> 01:08:04,880 think it's responsible for everything it 2035 01:08:08,789 --> 01:08:06,799 might be responsible for maybe some i've 2036 01:08:11,349 --> 01:08:08,799 seen a very small number of them but i 2037 01:08:13,109 --> 01:08:11,359 think if if this was the case i think 2038 01:08:15,190 --> 01:08:13,119 these kind of things that have been seen 2039 01:08:16,630 --> 01:08:15,200 in norway would have been seen much more 2040 01:08:18,630 --> 01:08:16,640 widespread 2041 01:08:19,910 --> 01:08:18,640 like everywhere because that was what 2042 01:08:21,510 --> 01:08:19,920 effectively the spread of the foo 2043 01:08:23,990 --> 01:08:21,520 fighter cases and also everything that 2044 01:08:25,990 --> 01:08:24,000 came afterwards and i'm not entirely 2045 01:08:27,990 --> 01:08:26,000 sure i mean i might be wrong here but 2046 01:08:31,110 --> 01:08:28,000 i'm not entirely sure that you know that 2047 01:08:33,349 --> 01:08:31,120 phenomenon it sounds localized it sounds 2048 01:08:35,749 --> 01:08:33,359 localized to particular areas probably 2049 01:08:38,070 --> 01:08:35,759 for particular reasons um it might be 2050 01:08:39,430 --> 01:08:38,080 down to the kind of geological stresses 2051 01:08:41,110 --> 01:08:39,440 i believe that's something that's been 2052 01:08:43,030 --> 01:08:41,120 put forward as to the reason why there's 2053 01:08:45,590 --> 01:08:43,040 this kind of pent up energy that gets 2054 01:08:47,349 --> 01:08:45,600 released every so often um say i'm not 2055 01:08:49,590 --> 01:08:47,359 i'm not you know by any means like you 2056 01:08:51,510 --> 01:08:49,600 read up totally on this particular field 2057 01:08:53,349 --> 01:08:51,520 and this is just what i understand 2058 01:08:55,110 --> 01:08:53,359 but i don't see that as being something 2059 01:08:57,030 --> 01:08:55,120 that's you know kind of commonplace 2060 01:08:59,990 --> 01:08:57,040 everywhere that will only be in certain 2061 01:09:02,070 --> 01:09:00,000 places on the globe so that to me 2062 01:09:04,149 --> 01:09:02,080 doesn't account for certain other 2063 01:09:05,430 --> 01:09:04,159 stories and also for the tic tacs 2064 01:09:07,430 --> 01:09:05,440 because bear in mind the tic tacs are 2065 01:09:09,910 --> 01:09:07,440 over water yeah and i'm not entirely 2066 01:09:11,349 --> 01:09:09,920 sure how that would work over water so i 2067 01:09:13,349 --> 01:09:11,359 mean some of you know maybe maybe dan 2068 01:09:15,749 --> 01:09:13,359 could explain that to me you know pretty 2069 01:09:17,349 --> 01:09:15,759 much the the piezoelectric effects 2070 01:09:20,950 --> 01:09:17,359 you're looking at pretty much fault 2071 01:09:22,229 --> 01:09:20,960 lines so you know if they run underwater 2072 01:09:24,149 --> 01:09:22,239 it doesn't have to be some kind of 2073 01:09:25,749 --> 01:09:24,159 crystals as well 2074 01:09:27,030 --> 01:09:25,759 maybe this is an idea that's been 2075 01:09:28,630 --> 01:09:27,040 proposed but the trouble is with the 2076 01:09:30,390 --> 01:09:28,640 hairstyle on lights and you know the 2077 01:09:31,990 --> 01:09:30,400 earth lights in general is that there's 2078 01:09:34,149 --> 01:09:32,000 a lot of ideas 2079 01:09:36,630 --> 01:09:34,159 but there's not really a lot of lab 2080 01:09:39,189 --> 01:09:36,640 study going on and stuff like that so i 2081 01:09:41,030 --> 01:09:39,199 feel like at some point avila might 2082 01:09:42,550 --> 01:09:41,040 photograph one of these things and 2083 01:09:44,550 --> 01:09:42,560 scientists will finally kind of get 2084 01:09:46,149 --> 01:09:44,560 started down that road as we're kind of 2085 01:09:48,709 --> 01:09:46,159 exploring all these other things as well 2086 01:09:50,950 --> 01:09:48,719 because we we know you know not not all 2087 01:09:53,110 --> 01:09:50,960 like graham said in all ufo experiences 2088 01:09:55,350 --> 01:09:53,120 uh you know et or something like that 2089 01:09:58,630 --> 01:09:55,360 they could be other things um and it's 2090 01:10:00,870 --> 01:09:58,640 no less fascinating to kind of go wait a 2091 01:10:03,270 --> 01:10:00,880 ball of self-organizing matter that has 2092 01:10:05,189 --> 01:10:03,280 anti-gravity properties and isn't 2093 01:10:07,669 --> 01:10:05,199 affected by the wind and has a 2094 01:10:08,709 --> 01:10:07,679 consistent surface temperature like what 2095 01:10:10,550 --> 01:10:08,719 we can't 2096 01:10:14,149 --> 01:10:10,560 how is nature doing this it's incredible 2097 01:10:18,709 --> 01:10:16,550 in some instances it does seem that 2098 01:10:20,950 --> 01:10:18,719 that's the more sizable it is the more 2099 01:10:23,110 --> 01:10:20,960 intelligent it seems but we are 2100 01:10:24,709 --> 01:10:23,120 anthropomorph uh for the more morph 2101 01:10:26,709 --> 01:10:24,719 advising they said we were putting out 2102 01:10:28,070 --> 01:10:26,719 kind of human kind of you know sort of 2103 01:10:29,750 --> 01:10:28,080 experiences into it and saying well it's 2104 01:10:31,510 --> 01:10:29,760 following aircraft but that's how we can 2105 01:10:34,390 --> 01:10:31,520 see it it might not be it might be just 2106 01:10:35,990 --> 01:10:34,400 how it acts you know in its own state um 2107 01:10:37,590 --> 01:10:36,000 it's gonna be like a positive charge 2108 01:10:39,350 --> 01:10:37,600 negative charge attraction thing you 2109 01:10:42,950 --> 01:10:39,360 know the the 2110 01:10:44,870 --> 01:10:42,960 hestalian lights have been said to be 2111 01:10:46,630 --> 01:10:44,880 attracted to bodies of water and certain 2112 01:10:48,630 --> 01:10:46,640 things that you know similarly 2113 01:10:50,229 --> 01:10:48,640 associated with the uap and 2114 01:10:52,229 --> 01:10:50,239 we just don't know we need the study 2115 01:10:53,430 --> 01:10:52,239 yeah i'm open to the possibility that 2116 01:10:55,110 --> 01:10:53,440 there's some kind of unexplained 2117 01:10:57,110 --> 01:10:55,120 phenomenon and if that's the case and 2118 01:10:59,189 --> 01:10:57,120 that's that's tremendous in itself 2119 01:11:00,630 --> 01:10:59,199 that's almost as earth-shattering as as 2120 01:11:01,910 --> 01:11:00,640 maybe like you know something from 2121 01:11:02,630 --> 01:11:01,920 somewhere else 2122 01:11:04,310 --> 01:11:02,640 but 2123 01:11:07,030 --> 01:11:04,320 to me i know they were talking about was 2124 01:11:08,950 --> 01:11:07,040 it a car shape a car sized ball of 2125 01:11:10,790 --> 01:11:08,960 plasma and that was about the biggest 2126 01:11:11,990 --> 01:11:10,800 that they've discovered now one of the 2127 01:11:13,270 --> 01:11:12,000 foo fight reports i mean i'm not going 2128 01:11:15,910 --> 01:11:13,280 to give much away here but there was a 2129 01:11:17,510 --> 01:11:15,920 200 foot long object seen over northern 2130 01:11:19,910 --> 01:11:17,520 italy in 1942 2131 01:11:22,390 --> 01:11:19,920 now to the growth of that size 2132 01:11:26,070 --> 01:11:22,400 yeah so yeah 2133 01:11:27,669 --> 01:11:26,080 you've yeah it needs more study 2134 01:11:29,669 --> 01:11:27,679 doesn't it scientific 2135 01:11:31,990 --> 01:11:29,679 rigor 2136 01:11:33,270 --> 01:11:32,000 you know it needs a lot more it does 2137 01:11:35,669 --> 01:11:33,280 it's good that it's being brought up 2138 01:11:38,070 --> 01:11:35,679 though as well and so i i say you know 2139 01:11:39,030 --> 01:11:38,080 to people like campbell marrera it's 2140 01:11:40,709 --> 01:11:39,040 good that he's bringing it to the 2141 01:11:42,790 --> 01:11:40,719 forefront i think semantics play an 2142 01:11:45,030 --> 01:11:42,800 important part though don't 2143 01:11:47,189 --> 01:11:45,040 go from one to ten without going from 2144 01:11:49,030 --> 01:11:47,199 two to nine in between yeah first and 2145 01:11:51,030 --> 01:11:49,040 that is you can seriously no 2146 01:11:53,750 --> 01:11:51,040 i'm not dissing him sometimes 2147 01:11:56,310 --> 01:11:53,760 by going too far too fast you can switch 2148 01:11:57,990 --> 01:11:56,320 people off to certain things when there 2149 01:11:59,270 --> 01:11:58,000 could be valuable information down that 2150 01:12:00,950 --> 01:11:59,280 road you know 2151 01:12:03,030 --> 01:12:00,960 and i say that out of respect as well 2152 01:12:05,189 --> 01:12:03,040 because i'm not the kind of person to go 2153 01:12:06,630 --> 01:12:05,199 you're wrong you're wrong it certainly 2154 01:12:08,229 --> 01:12:06,640 isn't that because he might be on to 2155 01:12:10,709 --> 01:12:08,239 something that connects somewhere in 2156 01:12:12,390 --> 01:12:10,719 between but i then go out to the bigger 2157 01:12:13,830 --> 01:12:12,400 picture when you look at sightings of 2158 01:12:15,030 --> 01:12:13,840 other things like what about people that 2159 01:12:17,990 --> 01:12:15,040 have seen 2160 01:12:20,790 --> 01:12:18,000 huge physical craft like triangles for 2161 01:12:23,830 --> 01:12:20,800 example moving super slow over over a 2162 01:12:25,830 --> 01:12:23,840 populated area we cannot really relate 2163 01:12:26,950 --> 01:12:25,840 that to things like the hezdalen lights 2164 01:12:28,630 --> 01:12:26,960 the things that we've seen in the 2165 01:12:29,830 --> 01:12:28,640 podesta emails where things are coming 2166 01:12:32,950 --> 01:12:29,840 in from um 2167 01:12:34,790 --> 01:12:32,960 lower or upper atmosphere past 2168 01:12:36,390 --> 01:12:34,800 satellites and stuff 2169 01:12:38,709 --> 01:12:36,400 you know the hairstyle and lights and 2170 01:12:40,390 --> 01:12:38,719 things similar to that seem to be very 2171 01:12:41,350 --> 01:12:40,400 close to the ground on 2172 01:12:43,189 --> 01:12:41,360 like there's something happening 2173 01:12:44,709 --> 01:12:43,199 underground that's drawing them to them 2174 01:12:47,750 --> 01:12:44,719 i mean i'm kind of spitballing a little 2175 01:12:49,669 --> 01:12:47,760 bit they i i would say that they it has 2176 01:12:51,669 --> 01:12:49,679 been proposed that 2177 01:12:54,229 --> 01:12:51,679 you know certain factors play a part 2178 01:12:55,910 --> 01:12:54,239 like it has to be overground and they 2179 01:12:57,830 --> 01:12:55,920 have been disproven 2180 01:12:59,750 --> 01:12:57,840 um you know these things occur over 2181 01:13:01,750 --> 01:12:59,760 bodies of water and things like that 2182 01:13:04,390 --> 01:13:01,760 it's uh it's fascinating you know to to 2183 01:13:06,310 --> 01:13:04,400 me i think that it's it's more wondrous 2184 01:13:08,149 --> 01:13:06,320 than we think you know just kind of 2185 01:13:09,910 --> 01:13:08,159 saying ball lightning doesn't capture 2186 01:13:12,070 --> 01:13:09,920 what's there and the potential you know 2187 01:13:13,990 --> 01:13:12,080 it just it makes it sound like swamp gas 2188 01:13:15,510 --> 01:13:14,000 and i'm i'm not down for that you know 2189 01:13:17,270 --> 01:13:15,520 if it is the same as the hairstyling 2190 01:13:19,830 --> 01:13:17,280 lights then the hairstyle and lights are 2191 01:13:21,510 --> 01:13:19,840 something miraculous yeah absolutely but 2192 01:13:23,750 --> 01:13:21,520 then do you know what then it always 2193 01:13:25,030 --> 01:13:23,760 draws me back to is this conversation 2194 01:13:26,470 --> 01:13:25,040 all these little snippets that lou's 2195 01:13:27,189 --> 01:13:26,480 been putting out for a few months now 2196 01:13:28,790 --> 01:13:27,199 that 2197 01:13:31,350 --> 01:13:28,800 everything is related whether it be a 2198 01:13:33,750 --> 01:13:31,360 tic tac shape or a triangle shape and 2199 01:13:36,470 --> 01:13:33,760 they all correlate to the same thing but 2200 01:13:38,550 --> 01:13:36,480 for different purposes or reasons 2201 01:13:40,950 --> 01:13:38,560 yeah he's not ready to elude on that 2202 01:13:42,790 --> 01:13:40,960 he's stated that well in the near future 2203 01:13:44,709 --> 01:13:42,800 we we're working on something when we 2204 01:13:46,870 --> 01:13:44,719 may bring out and the information where 2205 01:13:49,350 --> 01:13:46,880 we can see the correlation between the 2206 01:13:51,189 --> 01:13:49,360 different shapes it's like oh man you're 2207 01:13:53,350 --> 01:13:51,199 leaving us hanging like 2208 01:13:56,630 --> 01:13:53,360 a serious cliffhanger at the end of part 2209 01:13:58,830 --> 01:13:56,640 one of a tv series or something like 2210 01:14:01,350 --> 01:13:58,840 do you know what i 2211 01:14:02,870 --> 01:14:01,360 mean so yeah 2212 01:14:04,950 --> 01:14:02,880 it's dangerous to go down a road or 2213 01:14:06,790 --> 01:14:04,960 isn't it when you sort of like put your 2214 01:14:09,030 --> 01:14:06,800 kind of you know your theory out on the 2215 01:14:11,030 --> 01:14:09,040 table and say right this is what it is 2216 01:14:12,310 --> 01:14:11,040 because you go you end up getting 2217 01:14:14,470 --> 01:14:12,320 yourself sort of penned into a 2218 01:14:16,630 --> 01:14:14,480 particular kind of like you know sort of 2219 01:14:18,070 --> 01:14:16,640 um you know position where you end up 2220 01:14:19,270 --> 01:14:18,080 having to defend it 2221 01:14:20,870 --> 01:14:19,280 and then you have to that's when you 2222 01:14:23,030 --> 01:14:20,880 start people you see people's twisting 2223 01:14:24,790 --> 01:14:23,040 and turning trying to suit information 2224 01:14:26,709 --> 01:14:24,800 take information and twist it so it 2225 01:14:28,229 --> 01:14:26,719 suits their position rather than just 2226 01:14:29,430 --> 01:14:28,239 starting from the position well we've 2227 01:14:31,510 --> 01:14:29,440 got this information which actually 2228 01:14:33,110 --> 01:14:31,520 don't know what it leads to um you know 2229 01:14:34,870 --> 01:14:33,120 i'm not telling anybody in the book and 2230 01:14:37,110 --> 01:14:34,880 this is probably no secret that you know 2231 01:14:39,030 --> 01:14:37,120 i never tell anybody oh i know what this 2232 01:14:40,149 --> 01:14:39,040 is it's always this it's that it's that 2233 01:14:41,830 --> 01:14:40,159 you know i'd never say that because 2234 01:14:43,030 --> 01:14:41,840 actually i don't know what things are 2235 01:14:44,390 --> 01:14:43,040 you know this is this is the whole 2236 01:14:46,950 --> 01:14:44,400 reason i'm in this because i'm trying to 2237 01:14:48,470 --> 01:14:46,960 find out um and if you know i'm always 2238 01:14:50,310 --> 01:14:48,480 fond of saying that there's no experts 2239 01:14:51,830 --> 01:14:50,320 in this field and if anybody says oh i 2240 01:14:54,950 --> 01:14:51,840 know everything else i know what's going 2241 01:14:56,709 --> 01:14:54,960 on then you run like hell you know so 2242 01:14:58,149 --> 01:14:56,719 i'm not gonna you know if you get the 2243 01:14:59,990 --> 01:14:58,159 end of my book you're not gonna find the 2244 01:15:01,430 --> 01:15:00,000 answer you know and i'm sorry that 2245 01:15:02,709 --> 01:15:01,440 people are gonna look you know they're 2246 01:15:04,310 --> 01:15:02,719 gonna find a whole load of interesting 2247 01:15:06,310 --> 01:15:04,320 information there but they're not gonna 2248 01:15:08,310 --> 01:15:06,320 find the key to the door and i wouldn't 2249 01:15:10,950 --> 01:15:08,320 expect them to and i think you know and 2250 01:15:13,110 --> 01:15:10,960 nobody picking up a book for anybody 2251 01:15:15,110 --> 01:15:13,120 spoke about ufos at the moment is going 2252 01:15:17,270 --> 01:15:15,120 to find an answer they'll find more 2253 01:15:19,189 --> 01:15:17,280 questions than answers but that's that's 2254 01:15:21,750 --> 01:15:19,199 really where we've been for the last 70 2255 01:15:23,910 --> 01:15:21,760 odd years um but to sort of send 2256 01:15:25,590 --> 01:15:23,920 yourself down a road where you can't 2257 01:15:27,189 --> 01:15:25,600 turn back because you've already said 2258 01:15:28,950 --> 01:15:27,199 look it's these 2259 01:15:30,870 --> 01:15:28,960 it doesn't deliver yourself any maneuver 2260 01:15:32,790 --> 01:15:30,880 does it because then that data could 2261 01:15:34,149 --> 01:15:32,800 change to muradan couldn't it you know 2262 01:15:36,149 --> 01:15:34,159 it could send them down a completely 2263 01:15:39,110 --> 01:15:36,159 different road and then that's where 2264 01:15:40,709 --> 01:15:39,120 does that leave him you know so exactly 2265 01:15:42,709 --> 01:15:40,719 this is not a this is not a dig at 2266 01:15:44,550 --> 01:15:42,719 campbell but you know anybody that puts 2267 01:15:46,470 --> 01:15:44,560 themselves in that position stand to be 2268 01:15:49,830 --> 01:15:46,480 shot at basically don't they yeah they 2269 01:15:51,510 --> 01:15:49,840 do exactly i i think it's 2270 01:15:53,510 --> 01:15:51,520 you know we there are a lot of really 2271 01:15:57,110 --> 01:15:53,520 out there ideas in in this uh this 2272 01:15:59,110 --> 01:15:57,120 subject um and it's great to share them 2273 01:16:00,470 --> 01:15:59,120 so that they can be discussed 2274 01:16:03,030 --> 01:16:00,480 um 2275 01:16:05,669 --> 01:16:03,040 but you know being being aware that 2276 01:16:07,430 --> 01:16:05,679 something's being built to be discussed 2277 01:16:10,630 --> 01:16:07,440 is is kind of part of the process you 2278 01:16:12,470 --> 01:16:10,640 know no one's kind of got uh powerful 2279 01:16:14,390 --> 01:16:12,480 infallibility or anything like that 2280 01:16:16,470 --> 01:16:14,400 going on here um 2281 01:16:18,229 --> 01:16:16,480 what was the great quote that lou said 2282 01:16:21,030 --> 01:16:18,239 and anyone that says they know what's 2283 01:16:22,709 --> 01:16:21,040 going on is full of 2284 01:16:24,709 --> 01:16:22,719 i don't want to i don't want to have to 2285 01:16:26,630 --> 01:16:24,719 get you your rating for the youtube 2286 01:16:32,830 --> 01:16:26,640 channel no no no you can join this 2287 01:16:37,350 --> 01:16:35,430 can yeah greg graham's absolutely right 2288 01:16:39,830 --> 01:16:37,360 you know you've got to kind of keep all 2289 01:16:41,830 --> 01:16:39,840 these maybe plates spinning and be okay 2290 01:16:44,310 --> 01:16:41,840 with that and that's a big part of being 2291 01:16:46,550 --> 01:16:44,320 in this field and and again like you 2292 01:16:48,470 --> 01:16:46,560 said if if you're not wanting to do that 2293 01:16:49,910 --> 01:16:48,480 you need to kind of maybe step away and 2294 01:16:52,790 --> 01:16:49,920 put on the big bow pants and come back 2295 01:16:57,270 --> 01:16:55,270 yup you know that's the thing man like 2296 01:16:58,709 --> 01:16:57,280 you've got to be able to take it 2297 01:17:00,070 --> 01:16:58,719 even if you're not giving it you know 2298 01:17:02,229 --> 01:17:00,080 you may say something completely 2299 01:17:03,910 --> 01:17:02,239 innocent regarding this subject someone 2300 01:17:05,510 --> 01:17:03,920 might come back at you a bit more harsh 2301 01:17:07,030 --> 01:17:05,520 than you expected 2302 01:17:08,709 --> 01:17:07,040 and i think what i've learned is that 2303 01:17:09,669 --> 01:17:08,719 you don't then just go to their level 2304 01:17:12,070 --> 01:17:09,679 and 2305 01:17:13,669 --> 01:17:12,080 argue the point like 2306 01:17:15,669 --> 01:17:13,679 on their level 2307 01:17:18,310 --> 01:17:15,679 it's very difficult to navigate isn't it 2308 01:17:20,550 --> 01:17:18,320 it really is so i felt like i was about 2309 01:17:22,790 --> 01:17:20,560 to give a an alternative to how you do 2310 01:17:24,870 --> 01:17:22,800 it there is no answer it's just hold 2311 01:17:26,310 --> 01:17:24,880 your cool is all i can really say to 2312 01:17:27,990 --> 01:17:26,320 people you know 2313 01:17:29,110 --> 01:17:28,000 don't drop to levels 2314 01:17:31,590 --> 01:17:29,120 you know 2315 01:17:33,350 --> 01:17:31,600 if you have put him out a theory or 2316 01:17:35,990 --> 01:17:33,360 something that may have sounded a bit 2317 01:17:37,830 --> 01:17:36,000 more like factual 2318 01:17:40,229 --> 01:17:37,840 just just withdraw a little bit and say 2319 01:17:41,750 --> 01:17:40,239 well okay i apologize it may be more of 2320 01:17:43,830 --> 01:17:41,760 a theory than 2321 01:17:44,630 --> 01:17:43,840 me trying to say that this is what it is 2322 01:17:46,790 --> 01:17:44,640 and 2323 01:17:48,229 --> 01:17:46,800 i think that's where i see people going 2324 01:17:50,630 --> 01:17:48,239 wrong 2325 01:17:53,030 --> 01:17:50,640 and that's still quite broad 2326 01:17:53,750 --> 01:17:53,040 but i'd hate to be one of those people 2327 01:17:55,830 --> 01:17:53,760 there 2328 01:17:58,149 --> 01:17:55,840 i i make a claim or a statement that is 2329 01:18:01,189 --> 01:17:58,159 taken out of context because i don't 2330 01:18:02,790 --> 01:18:01,199 have the the vernacular or 2331 01:18:05,510 --> 01:18:02,800 i know it's difficult in a tweet and 2332 01:18:06,709 --> 01:18:05,520 stuff with so many words but you know 2333 01:18:07,910 --> 01:18:06,719 i'm still not doing a good job of 2334 01:18:09,590 --> 01:18:07,920 explaining this but do you know where 2335 01:18:11,590 --> 01:18:09,600 i'm coming from it's like here's here's 2336 01:18:13,590 --> 01:18:11,600 a quote arguing with idiots is like 2337 01:18:15,110 --> 01:18:13,600 playing chess with a pigeon no matter 2338 01:18:17,030 --> 01:18:15,120 how good you are the bird is going to 2339 01:18:20,149 --> 01:18:17,040 [\h__\h] on the board and strut around like 2340 01:18:23,350 --> 01:18:21,669 we see that 2341 01:18:25,669 --> 01:18:23,360 regularly 2342 01:18:26,950 --> 01:18:25,679 so thank you saved me there graham said 2343 01:18:29,750 --> 01:18:26,960 thank you 2344 01:18:31,590 --> 01:18:29,760 i really appreciate that man um so guys 2345 01:18:34,310 --> 01:18:31,600 we're hitting on like an hour and 20 2346 01:18:36,310 --> 01:18:34,320 minutes we could go on but i feel like 2347 01:18:39,030 --> 01:18:36,320 let's do this again let's do another uap 2348 01:18:40,950 --> 01:18:39,040 media live on on this channel in a few 2349 01:18:42,550 --> 01:18:40,960 weeks yeah absolutely we've got to get 2350 01:18:44,470 --> 01:18:42,560 you on with andy 2351 01:18:46,310 --> 01:18:44,480 man well listen i actually i did an 2352 01:18:48,310 --> 01:18:46,320 instagram live before this and i said to 2353 01:18:49,830 --> 01:18:48,320 people and i've said to a few people i 2354 01:18:51,910 --> 01:18:49,840 need to speak to andy you know we've 2355 01:18:53,270 --> 01:18:51,920 spoken in our in our private uab media 2356 01:18:55,270 --> 01:18:53,280 chat but 2357 01:18:56,790 --> 01:18:55,280 yeah i think i feel like i get the guy 2358 01:18:58,310 --> 01:18:56,800 already you know we're friends on 2359 01:19:00,070 --> 01:18:58,320 facebook as well on that kind of 2360 01:19:02,149 --> 01:19:00,080 personal level 2361 01:19:03,830 --> 01:19:02,159 so i you know he obviously sees my life 2362 01:19:06,070 --> 01:19:03,840 that i don't put out for the world and i 2363 01:19:08,709 --> 01:19:06,080 see a little bit of his and i think yeah 2364 01:19:10,790 --> 01:19:08,719 i i like this guy and i think it'll be a 2365 01:19:13,430 --> 01:19:10,800 great conversation for people to in 2366 01:19:15,270 --> 01:19:13,440 indulge and watch in so did you know 2367 01:19:16,950 --> 01:19:15,280 what i was i was looking at enough that 2368 01:19:18,550 --> 01:19:16,960 was it last month to actually meet him 2369 01:19:20,790 --> 01:19:18,560 in the flesh kind of thing 2370 01:19:22,149 --> 01:19:20,800 um we sat down and had a coffee and like 2371 01:19:23,830 --> 01:19:22,159 having a sort of like what was going to 2372 01:19:25,910 --> 01:19:23,840 be probably an hour's chat or something 2373 01:19:27,669 --> 01:19:25,920 turned out in three hours and we're just 2374 01:19:29,189 --> 01:19:27,679 sitting just sitting around the table 2375 01:19:30,950 --> 01:19:29,199 just like throwing stuff backwards and 2376 01:19:32,790 --> 01:19:30,960 forwards and it was wonderful and 2377 01:19:36,390 --> 01:19:32,800 bearing in mind i only really knew andy 2378 01:19:37,750 --> 01:19:36,400 before i joined uap media um as somebody 2379 01:19:39,350 --> 01:19:37,760 was doing a podcast and i did actually 2380 01:19:41,350 --> 01:19:39,360 you know sort of listen to his podcast 2381 01:19:44,470 --> 01:19:41,360 from day one albeit maybe a week or two 2382 01:19:46,149 --> 01:19:44,480 after he kicked off um and he was to me 2383 01:19:48,229 --> 01:19:46,159 it was just a great start where he how 2384 01:19:49,669 --> 01:19:48,239 he came into it and how he started 2385 01:19:51,669 --> 01:19:49,679 questioning people and particularly 2386 01:19:53,030 --> 01:19:51,679 style he adopted and it was just no 2387 01:19:54,709 --> 01:19:53,040 nonsense but asking questions that 2388 01:19:56,470 --> 01:19:54,719 nobody else had asked before and he had 2389 01:19:58,709 --> 01:19:56,480 a really good rapport with people from 2390 01:20:00,070 --> 01:19:58,719 the get-go um and i remember just 2391 01:20:02,630 --> 01:20:00,080 looking at the podcast and trying to 2392 01:20:04,550 --> 01:20:02,640 find podcasts that resonated with me and 2393 01:20:05,910 --> 01:20:04,560 i'd heard a couple of others um from 2394 01:20:07,750 --> 01:20:05,920 other people beforehand because there 2395 01:20:10,709 --> 01:20:07,760 wasn't that many around back then you 2396 01:20:12,709 --> 01:20:10,719 know sort of pre-covered um and they 2397 01:20:15,189 --> 01:20:12,719 were pretty not not awful but they were 2398 01:20:16,870 --> 01:20:15,199 just quite stayed you know that they 2399 01:20:19,030 --> 01:20:16,880 were they weren't particularly exciting 2400 01:20:20,790 --> 01:20:19,040 they were quite knowing as well you had 2401 01:20:22,950 --> 01:20:20,800 to almost have like a certain amount of 2402 01:20:24,709 --> 01:20:22,960 knowledge to get into them yeah which i 2403 01:20:26,709 --> 01:20:24,719 felt was you know was was quite kind of 2404 01:20:28,870 --> 01:20:26,719 limiting um and they didn't really say 2405 01:20:30,310 --> 01:20:28,880 much and one of the hosts just kept 2406 01:20:32,070 --> 01:20:30,320 forgetting what he was saying in terms 2407 01:20:33,590 --> 01:20:32,080 of what he was asking it was just oh for 2408 01:20:34,310 --> 01:20:33,600 god's sake you know 2409 01:20:36,870 --> 01:20:34,320 so 2410 01:20:39,110 --> 01:20:36,880 it was just like cringe worthy and then 2411 01:20:41,030 --> 01:20:39,120 andy came on the scene and it was it was 2412 01:20:43,110 --> 01:20:41,040 wow this is really good and then of 2413 01:20:44,629 --> 01:20:43,120 course the guests he was getting was 2414 01:20:47,110 --> 01:20:44,639 just something else as well and how the 2415 01:20:48,790 --> 01:20:47,120 hell do you do this mate you know but 2416 01:20:50,629 --> 01:20:48,800 then get to know him as well it was even 2417 01:20:52,550 --> 01:20:50,639 better because he's just well he's just 2418 01:20:55,189 --> 01:20:52,560 like how he is on on the podcast you 2419 01:20:57,270 --> 01:20:55,199 know he's great but also every by a set 2420 01:21:00,229 --> 01:20:57,280 by extension you know people like dan 2421 01:21:02,229 --> 01:21:00,239 people like chris um you know um adam 2422 01:21:03,990 --> 01:21:02,239 and dave everybody's the same as well 2423 01:21:06,310 --> 01:21:04,000 they're really really great people to to 2424 01:21:08,629 --> 01:21:06,320 know and to to work with um i'm 2425 01:21:11,110 --> 01:21:08,639 fortunate i was i was fortunate the day 2426 01:21:12,550 --> 01:21:11,120 they asked me uh to join and 2427 01:21:13,910 --> 01:21:12,560 it's one of these things i get again 2428 01:21:15,750 --> 01:21:13,920 i'll still pinch myself and think am i 2429 01:21:17,350 --> 01:21:15,760 really part of all this you know you had 2430 01:21:18,790 --> 01:21:17,360 like a double whammy dad as well i've 2431 01:21:19,830 --> 01:21:18,800 got it i've got i've got imposter 2432 01:21:21,830 --> 01:21:19,840 syndrome 2433 01:21:23,510 --> 01:21:21,840 no i feel exactly the same i mean it's 2434 01:21:27,030 --> 01:21:23,520 what been what a month since i've been 2435 01:21:29,350 --> 01:21:27,040 part of uap media uk and when i had that 2436 01:21:30,870 --> 01:21:29,360 meeting with dan on that well no well 2437 01:21:33,110 --> 01:21:30,880 let's take it back to 2438 01:21:36,550 --> 01:21:33,120 if all of you watching now live or 2439 01:21:38,870 --> 01:21:36,560 anyone else go back to the uap media 2440 01:21:40,629 --> 01:21:38,880 episode that i put out on youtube 2441 01:21:42,390 --> 01:21:40,639 uh we finished that conversation and 2442 01:21:44,310 --> 01:21:42,400 afterwards i said look i if there's 2443 01:21:47,590 --> 01:21:44,320 anything i can do to help 2444 01:21:49,590 --> 01:21:47,600 uap media uk or anything let me know 2445 01:21:51,590 --> 01:21:49,600 and funny enough dan contacted me the 2446 01:21:53,430 --> 01:21:51,600 next day on this private chat like a 2447 01:21:54,950 --> 01:21:53,440 little bit ominous and 2448 01:21:56,550 --> 01:21:54,960 i was like okay what's going on here we 2449 01:21:58,950 --> 01:21:56,560 have this private chat and that was 2450 01:22:01,669 --> 01:21:58,960 where i got the invitation to join which 2451 01:22:03,270 --> 01:22:01,679 still to this day blows my mind um and 2452 01:22:05,110 --> 01:22:03,280 is an honor 2453 01:22:06,870 --> 01:22:05,120 but um 2454 01:22:08,229 --> 01:22:06,880 this is something i've had that one was 2455 01:22:10,149 --> 01:22:08,239 i'll just say that one was a funny one 2456 01:22:12,629 --> 01:22:10,159 as well because graham and i had spoken 2457 01:22:14,149 --> 01:22:12,639 about you know asking you in the future 2458 01:22:16,390 --> 01:22:14,159 and kind of you know speaking to the 2459 01:22:18,390 --> 01:22:16,400 other guys and then yeah a few weeks 2460 01:22:20,229 --> 01:22:18,400 later you kind of asked and it was like 2461 01:22:22,070 --> 01:22:20,239 i remember the cat going got my tongue 2462 01:22:24,229 --> 01:22:22,080 because i wanted to tell you that we'd 2463 01:22:25,350 --> 01:22:24,239 spoken about it already but i couldn't i 2464 01:22:26,950 --> 01:22:25,360 kind of you know there were a few more 2465 01:22:28,390 --> 01:22:26,960 people i had to kind of speak to but 2466 01:22:30,310 --> 01:22:28,400 yeah as soon as you know it was a 2467 01:22:31,669 --> 01:22:30,320 no-brainer really for everyone that's 2468 01:22:32,790 --> 01:22:31,679 incredible i don't know how to hold our 2469 01:22:33,830 --> 01:22:32,800 tongues when we're talking to you but 2470 01:22:38,390 --> 01:22:33,840 we're actually messing with you there's 2471 01:22:41,270 --> 01:22:38,400 a time going yeah should we tell him 2472 01:22:42,550 --> 01:22:41,280 that's incredible man that's i i still i 2473 01:22:43,990 --> 01:22:42,560 don't know how to react to that it's 2474 01:22:46,470 --> 01:22:44,000 humbling and it's 2475 01:22:48,310 --> 01:22:46,480 it's really nice and it again it's 2476 01:22:50,470 --> 01:22:48,320 something i say to people that take the 2477 01:22:52,550 --> 01:22:50,480 time to watch my channels or follow me 2478 01:22:54,149 --> 01:22:52,560 on instagram it just motivates me to 2479 01:22:55,990 --> 01:22:54,159 keep doing what i'm doing because it 2480 01:22:57,669 --> 01:22:56,000 obviously says i'm doing something in 2481 01:22:59,270 --> 01:22:57,679 the right direction you know i'm not 2482 01:23:01,270 --> 01:22:59,280 very good at taking compliments and 2483 01:23:03,189 --> 01:23:01,280 things like that but it's still i do my 2484 01:23:03,990 --> 01:23:03,199 work and i do my research and i do my 2485 01:23:07,189 --> 01:23:04,000 thing 2486 01:23:09,030 --> 01:23:07,199 so thank you guys that's so kind and 2487 01:23:10,870 --> 01:23:09,040 and i will just give a big shout out to 2488 01:23:12,950 --> 01:23:10,880 everyone on your ap media uk but 2489 01:23:15,830 --> 01:23:12,960 specifically yesterday or today chris 2490 01:23:18,709 --> 01:23:15,840 sharp wrote this incredible article um 2491 01:23:21,590 --> 01:23:18,719 where uh it's the the a very british 2492 01:23:23,669 --> 01:23:21,600 folly which is amazing and that's so 2493 01:23:26,390 --> 01:23:23,679 chris sharp um 2494 01:23:28,229 --> 01:23:26,400 where he he let me do a quote and it 2495 01:23:29,350 --> 01:23:28,239 really seems to have gone down quite 2496 01:23:31,590 --> 01:23:29,360 well and opened up some more 2497 01:23:33,990 --> 01:23:31,600 conversations on my end especially 2498 01:23:36,229 --> 01:23:34,000 through my social medias i think across 2499 01:23:37,830 --> 01:23:36,239 others as well so chris sharp if you're 2500 01:23:40,870 --> 01:23:37,840 watching or you watch this later thank 2501 01:23:42,070 --> 01:23:40,880 you brother i appreciate it so yeah i 2502 01:23:43,430 --> 01:23:42,080 think that's 2503 01:23:46,310 --> 01:23:43,440 given me 2504 01:23:48,149 --> 01:23:46,320 a bit of confidence to maybe even start 2505 01:23:49,110 --> 01:23:48,159 the thoughts of writing an article about 2506 01:23:50,310 --> 01:23:49,120 something 2507 01:23:51,350 --> 01:23:50,320 so yeah 2508 01:23:53,430 --> 01:23:51,360 do it 2509 01:23:55,510 --> 01:23:53,440 i think exactly i might i think i might 2510 01:23:56,790 --> 01:23:55,520 anyway i need to get back i need to get 2511 01:23:58,870 --> 01:23:56,800 back writing things as well because 2512 01:24:00,149 --> 01:23:58,880 that's what i was brought on for so i 2513 01:24:01,110 --> 01:24:00,159 feel like i'm sort of letting the side 2514 01:24:02,790 --> 01:24:01,120 down a bit because i haven't written 2515 01:24:04,390 --> 01:24:02,800 anything for european movies 2516 01:24:05,910 --> 01:24:04,400 i'll tell you what i still revert back 2517 01:24:08,870 --> 01:24:05,920 to your article about the intelligence 2518 01:24:11,189 --> 01:24:08,880 authorization the fiscal 2022 stuff that 2519 01:24:13,669 --> 01:24:11,199 article you wrote i probably revert back 2520 01:24:16,070 --> 01:24:13,679 to that once a day at least 2521 01:24:18,229 --> 01:24:16,080 at least for the past few weeks because 2522 01:24:20,229 --> 01:24:18,239 of the little pointers that i need there 2523 01:24:23,510 --> 01:24:20,239 is one place i can go and it's your 2524 01:24:25,830 --> 01:24:23,520 article so kudos no no thank you man 2525 01:24:27,590 --> 01:24:25,840 because it's it's invaluable 2526 01:24:28,870 --> 01:24:27,600 you know if i get asked a question about 2527 01:24:30,870 --> 01:24:28,880 it i'm not i'm not going to some 2528 01:24:33,189 --> 01:24:30,880 american thing over there and stuff 2529 01:24:34,550 --> 01:24:33,199 which most people would assume i should 2530 01:24:36,470 --> 01:24:34,560 because you've con 2531 01:24:38,790 --> 01:24:36,480 condensed it but it's even not condensed 2532 01:24:41,910 --> 01:24:38,800 it's still quite a thorough article it 2533 01:24:44,229 --> 01:24:41,920 has all the important pieces of where 2534 01:24:45,830 --> 01:24:44,239 we're looking for what's coming up with 2535 01:24:47,669 --> 01:24:45,840 dan's countdown which we can probably 2536 01:24:50,070 --> 01:24:47,679 talk about dan is bringing the countdown 2537 01:24:51,990 --> 01:24:50,080 back yeah where is it where is it now 2538 01:24:55,590 --> 01:24:52,000 did it did it did it 2539 01:24:56,830 --> 01:24:55,600 16 days there we go it is 2540 01:25:04,229 --> 01:24:56,840 it 2541 01:25:05,830 --> 01:25:04,239 the first 1990 day update from the uaptf 2542 01:25:08,950 --> 01:25:05,840 to congress whether there's a public 2543 01:25:10,470 --> 01:25:08,960 facet of that we do not know um probably 2544 01:25:12,950 --> 01:25:10,480 not but 2545 01:25:15,430 --> 01:25:12,960 you know given given that we had uh 2546 01:25:18,550 --> 01:25:15,440 correct me wrong tim tim burgess uh on 2547 01:25:21,430 --> 01:25:18,560 the big phone home um he was great um 2548 01:25:23,110 --> 01:25:21,440 and he he clearly had been into ufos for 2549 01:25:25,510 --> 01:25:23,120 a long time and had an interest in this 2550 01:25:26,629 --> 01:25:25,520 phenomena um and it was like to me i 2551 01:25:27,750 --> 01:25:26,639 don't know about you guys but that was a 2552 01:25:29,350 --> 01:25:27,760 really encouraging moment of the big 2553 01:25:31,990 --> 01:25:29,360 phone too i was like goddamn because 2554 01:25:33,270 --> 01:25:32,000 there's a you know a congressman on here 2555 01:25:34,550 --> 01:25:33,280 um this is the thing that chris was 2556 01:25:36,870 --> 01:25:34,560 saying his article though can you 2557 01:25:38,070 --> 01:25:36,880 imagine one of our mps 2558 01:25:40,709 --> 01:25:38,080 coming forward 2559 01:25:42,550 --> 01:25:40,719 and saying that on a news channel or you 2560 01:25:44,149 --> 01:25:42,560 know or just on a youtube group like 2561 01:25:45,830 --> 01:25:44,159 this or coming on to the you know the 2562 01:25:47,590 --> 01:25:45,840 big phone home and saying yeah i'm 2563 01:25:49,110 --> 01:25:47,600 really interested interested in this i 2564 01:25:50,470 --> 01:25:49,120 want to do something about it i think we 2565 01:26:09,669 --> 01:25:50,480 should be doing this we should be having 2566 01:26:12,790 --> 01:26:11,350 you know i wonder about the capabilities 2567 01:26:14,790 --> 01:26:12,800 of the uk and whether we have the same 2568 01:26:16,149 --> 01:26:14,800 capabilities as america or anything 2569 01:26:17,910 --> 01:26:16,159 close to it because they've had a bunch 2570 01:26:20,790 --> 01:26:17,920 of upgrades and you know they're the 2571 01:26:23,110 --> 01:26:20,800 biggest military on the planet um 2572 01:26:25,189 --> 01:26:23,120 so it might just be that we we don't 2573 01:26:27,990 --> 01:26:25,199 detect these things as much you know and 2574 01:26:29,270 --> 01:26:28,000 i'd i'd be curious because 2575 01:26:32,310 --> 01:26:29,280 we know america's watching the whole 2576 01:26:33,750 --> 01:26:32,320 planet so i'd be curious to see 2577 01:26:35,830 --> 01:26:33,760 whether america have told other 2578 01:26:37,430 --> 01:26:35,840 countries oh hey we're seeing these 2579 01:26:42,950 --> 01:26:37,440 things over your you know especially 2580 01:26:46,709 --> 01:26:44,390 let's have that discussion next time 2581 01:26:48,310 --> 01:26:46,719 because i think we're still in these 2582 01:26:50,550 --> 01:26:48,320 days where i think it's just starting to 2583 01:26:52,470 --> 01:26:50,560 ramp up a bit in my my head a little bit 2584 01:26:54,709 --> 01:26:52,480 we're just seeing little snippets of 2585 01:26:56,550 --> 01:26:54,719 that's quiet period ending maybe it's 2586 01:26:58,149 --> 01:26:56,560 just because of the big phone home and 2587 01:26:59,669 --> 01:26:58,159 people like graham putting out books and 2588 01:27:00,390 --> 01:26:59,679 these conversations are happening more 2589 01:27:02,310 --> 01:27:00,400 but 2590 01:27:03,910 --> 01:27:02,320 maybe that has an effect i don't know it 2591 01:27:05,030 --> 01:27:03,920 does it does have an effect you know 2592 01:27:07,270 --> 01:27:05,040 what 2593 01:27:10,390 --> 01:27:07,280 mick always says oh i'm tracking the the 2594 01:27:11,990 --> 01:27:10,400 google trends for the uap language but 2595 01:27:14,070 --> 01:27:12,000 not everyone's using that term you know 2596 01:27:16,709 --> 01:27:14,080 we're discussing things in other ways uh 2597 01:27:19,110 --> 01:27:16,719 through through other means and and 2598 01:27:21,110 --> 01:27:19,120 all of them contribute to people using 2599 01:27:22,790 --> 01:27:21,120 their voice to you know we have these 2600 01:27:24,070 --> 01:27:22,800 conversations in our rooms then we have 2601 01:27:25,910 --> 01:27:24,080 them out on the street then we have them 2602 01:27:28,310 --> 01:27:25,920 in russia and it kind of it all builds 2603 01:27:30,149 --> 01:27:28,320 to a paradigm shift over time and 2604 01:27:32,149 --> 01:27:30,159 and you know we we've been witnessing 2605 01:27:33,430 --> 01:27:32,159 the shift so just everyone keep going if 2606 01:27:34,629 --> 01:27:33,440 you want to make something make it if 2607 01:27:39,110 --> 01:27:34,639 you think you can do better than someone 2608 01:27:41,830 --> 01:27:40,390 next time i'm going to have that as a 2609 01:27:44,070 --> 01:27:41,840 quote on the back of the book that was 2610 01:27:44,790 --> 01:27:44,080 awesome i like that it was that was 2611 01:27:46,870 --> 01:27:44,800 great 2612 01:27:48,390 --> 01:27:46,880 i came out of nowhere done i like it 2613 01:27:50,470 --> 01:27:48,400 yeah sorry 2614 01:27:53,350 --> 01:27:50,480 no no no please i ruined it i should 2615 01:27:55,910 --> 01:27:53,360 have just dropped the mic and left 2616 01:27:58,229 --> 01:27:55,920 so any final thoughts graham leading out 2617 01:28:00,310 --> 01:27:58,239 other than please everyone going by the 2618 01:28:02,629 --> 01:28:00,320 book and following oh well i wouldn't 2619 01:28:04,629 --> 01:28:02,639 say that anyway but um do you know i'm 2620 01:28:07,590 --> 01:28:04,639 happy to be part of you i'm happy to be 2621 01:28:09,110 --> 01:28:07,600 part of uap media because it's a great 2622 01:28:10,870 --> 01:28:09,120 vehicle for people trying to you know 2623 01:28:13,189 --> 01:28:10,880 put the word across not just to people 2624 01:28:15,110 --> 01:28:13,199 like ourselves and and the public lodge 2625 01:28:16,790 --> 01:28:15,120 but also through journalism also to 2626 01:28:18,390 --> 01:28:16,800 politicians to people who can make the 2627 01:28:20,149 --> 01:28:18,400 decisions you know like they've been 2628 01:28:22,390 --> 01:28:20,159 able to do in the states we need to be 2629 01:28:23,750 --> 01:28:22,400 able to do that here and you know i 2630 01:28:25,830 --> 01:28:23,760 finally found that 2631 01:28:27,910 --> 01:28:25,840 i can make a little tiny little 2632 01:28:29,590 --> 01:28:27,920 difference in a group that say you know 2633 01:28:31,350 --> 01:28:29,600 sort of pushing in that direction and 2634 01:28:33,270 --> 01:28:31,360 that's wonderful and also along the way 2635 01:28:35,030 --> 01:28:33,280 i've been fortunate to meet and and work 2636 01:28:37,750 --> 01:28:35,040 with and be friends with it a really 2637 01:28:39,990 --> 01:28:37,760 good bunch of people so you know i'm 2638 01:28:42,790 --> 01:28:40,000 grateful every day for that so yeah 2639 01:28:45,510 --> 01:28:42,800 thank you thank you guys ah that means 2640 01:28:47,189 --> 01:28:45,520 the world to me thank you so much man 2641 01:28:49,189 --> 01:28:47,199 and and i'll give i will give another 2642 01:28:50,310 --> 01:28:49,199 shout out to our other colleagues 2643 01:28:52,550 --> 01:28:50,320 dave 2644 01:28:53,830 --> 01:28:52,560 partridge we love him to bids um can't 2645 01:28:56,390 --> 01:28:53,840 wait to have him back on the show and 2646 01:28:59,830 --> 01:28:56,400 speak to him some more andy mcgrillen 2647 01:29:01,430 --> 01:28:59,840 adam goldsack need to connect man adam 2648 01:29:03,030 --> 01:29:01,440 uh chris 2649 01:29:04,629 --> 01:29:03,040 good luck getting them on here though 2650 01:29:06,310 --> 01:29:04,639 well listen i understand adam's got a 2651 01:29:08,149 --> 01:29:06,320 lot going on in his life career 2652 01:29:09,189 --> 01:29:08,159 education and all that kind of thing 2653 01:29:12,390 --> 01:29:09,199 great 2654 01:29:13,830 --> 01:29:12,400 of the whole thing so guys listen 2655 01:29:16,149 --> 01:29:13,840 finally just thank you so much for 2656 01:29:20,070 --> 01:29:16,159 joining me tonight it's always always a 2657 01:29:21,510 --> 01:29:20,080 pleasure super pleasure so um yeah i'll 2658 01:29:30,070 --> 01:29:21,520 speak to you probably in like 10 minutes 2659 01:29:32,149 --> 01:29:31,430 are you going straight on to instagram 2660 01:29:34,709 --> 01:29:32,159 now 2661 01:29:37,030 --> 01:29:34,719 um i think i'm going to actually yeah 2662 01:29:38,229 --> 01:29:37,040 okay i'm doing a post mortem i am but 2663 01:29:39,750 --> 01:29:38,239 i've actually got i've got another 2664 01:29:42,070 --> 01:29:39,760 interview in half an hour which i don't 2665 01:29:44,550 --> 01:29:42,080 know he's alive on youtube or not i'll 2666 01:29:46,870 --> 01:29:44,560 see i've got to just check my messages 2667 01:29:50,070 --> 01:29:46,880 um i'll allude to that in a minute one 2668 01:29:51,030 --> 01:29:50,080 one word or two words sorry is 2669 01:29:52,149 --> 01:29:51,040 actually no because you're going to 2670 01:29:53,910 --> 01:29:52,159 think something else i'm going to say it 2671 01:29:55,350 --> 01:29:53,920 mystery wire 2672 01:29:57,350 --> 01:29:55,360 but it ain't what you're thinking is it 2673 01:30:00,149 --> 01:29:57,360 ain't what you think it is 2674 01:30:03,430 --> 01:30:00,159 well it's one of two right 2675 01:30:05,510 --> 01:30:03,440 uh maybe one of three four okay no you 2676 01:30:06,229 --> 01:30:05,520 don't need three wire okay 2677 01:30:07,669 --> 01:30:06,239 okay 2678 01:30:09,750 --> 01:30:07,679 nice i probably should have said that 2679 01:30:12,550 --> 01:30:09,760 because the chat are gonna go for the 2680 01:30:14,070 --> 01:30:12,560 the big wigs um 2681 01:30:15,189 --> 01:30:14,080 but it might be pre-recorded so i'll let 2682 01:30:16,550 --> 01:30:15,199 everyone know so i'm gonna jump in 2683 01:30:18,310 --> 01:30:16,560 instagram after i've checked my messages 2684 01:30:21,510 --> 01:30:18,320 and let everyone know but guys thank you 2685 01:30:23,590 --> 01:30:21,520 so much speak to you soon thank you